2023-10-02 00:00:00 - Joint Committee on Consumer Protection and Professional Licensure
2023-10-02 00:00:00 - Joint Committee on Consumer Protection and Professional Licensure
SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Good afternoon, everyone.
Good afternoon, everyone. Welcome to the joint committee on consumer protection professional licensure. My name is Jackie Chan. I'm the house chair of this committee to my right as Senator John Cronin. I'm gonna do a quick introduction of the members behind me in no particular favoritism. To my right, we have Representative Reyes, Representative Moschino, Representative World, Senator Timothy, to my left, we have Representative Lab, Representative Sean, Representative McKenna, and Representative Howet. This is the members of the committee here. Today, we are going to hear, testimony on 2 bills only. House both 3, 741. House both 3. I'm sorry. 2380. A relative both to liquor license, alcohol expansion in City of Boston, submit as a home competition, by the council, and the mayor. Some housekeeping order, things to get started with. This is indeed a public hearing. You are being recorded, behind us, under the state information systems. This recording is permanent. So you can choose what you wanna say and not to say, but be aware you're gonna be online forever. Also be aware that, this is a public hearing, and I've noticed people have, like, their cameras out and their cell phone and video. So be also aware that you may be re supported by someone in the audience. So be aware of that. Also, the testimony we're receiving folks is about 3 minutes per person subject to the discretion of the chair, and you can be, and will be subject to questioning by the109 members of the committee. We will be continuing to take written testimony into the bills dispensed with. So the rules, of the committee is that we will continue to take, written and, electronic testimony at the joint committee's website. The email is actually fairly long, but you can go to the a joint committee, consumer129 protection professional licensure. We will take testimony until the bill is dispensed133 with. Anything else, chair croning? Okay? Oh, I'm sorry. Vice chair Mary Keith of the committee is actually with us on video. As we know, this is a busy day, allegedly as we popping on and off video as well as149 in the room, throughout the afternoon. And with that, that's pretty much the housekeeping matters that I need to go through. Again, discretion to chair folks of how this goes. With that, we historically take elected officials out of turn we do understand a very busy schedule. And today, we're gonna start with the honorable Michelle Wu, madam and we're bringing up several counselors, with her. As well as, your, I think your economic development person is here as well. So, come on down.
Yeah. That's that's alright. We can give a second set up. And, the my for everyone's notification, the microphones192 are not hot. You actually have to push the button in the bright it goes on red. And given the fact that we are in internet world, we do advise people to please
Stand that there's always some technical difficulties. So, please be patient with us when people try to use Microsoft Teams. So,
if you could be kind of just to for the record, introduce yourselves as part of the record through the process. Thank you.
MAYOR MICHELLE WU - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good morning or good afternoon at this point. Thank you227 so much, chair Chan, chair Cronin, and229 honorable members of the committee for convening this hearing. I am very grateful to be here to testify in support of our home rule petition filed by, city councilor, Brian Worrell, city Councilor Ruthzee Louijeune, and city Councilor Ricardo Arroyo, passed by the council and signed and heaved up to you all, a little bit ago. This is an incredibly important issue for the city in the midst of economic recovery. And, I'm very grateful that we255 have the chance to address this in partnership with the state. Thank you to Representative Chris Worrell and Senator Liz Miranda, for taking this up and sponsoring it at the in the legislature. And I also want to recognize that we're also joined by City Councilor Sharon Durkan.
I believe city Councilor Gigi Coletta may be coming later as well. And, some members of the Boston delegation who were very grateful for their support and leadership. We are fighting every day for Boston to be a city that is the best in the country for families and for that sense of inclusion and opportunity in292 the future to help support a vibrant regional and statewide economy296 as well It is a very tough time as we all still know for small businesses recovering from the pandemic and for families who are looking to rebuild and to strengthen our communities back. We are lucky in Boston to have a vibrant and diverse culinary scene. one that plays a crucial role in our local economy and cultural identity, creating that sense of welcome for everyone across the world and our residents, most of all.
From Pupusas in East Boston, Fuh, and Little Saigon, Arancini in the north end, Chowder Downtown, Yoruba sells stew in Nubian Square, soup dumplings in Chinatown, so much of how we define ourselves, our sense of home, and community is in connection with the experiences that we have at restaurants and in in community with our friends, family, and loved ones. But we know that for a long time, Boston's structure of liquor licenses has not facilitated equitable and, and growing economic opportunity for all. Even though the talent is here in Boston, the dollars are here in Boston, we're often seeing neighborhood spending those elsewhere because of disparities created by the system. Today, as I've been told by some of the folks who in the middle of these transactions, a full liquor license is going for $600,000 plus in the city of Boston.
374 And374 that means that when they open up, they often get pulled to areas of the city with378 higher foot traffic, wealthier areas380 less diverse and representative of all of the cultures of Austin. We're excited for every restaurant to open up, but we need to ensure that every neighborhood is a space for that kind of home welcome and economic opportunity. We have a system now where some neighborhoods have397 more than 60 liquor licenses, and some have fewer than 10. It is those neighborhoods that are often home to lower income residents, residents of color where there are hardly any sit down restaurants, if any, at all. Our economic recovery in Boston is tied to the economic recovery of the state. And our specific recovery in the city will depend on what happens here with this legislation, whether the opportunities in the food and beverage industry and larger hospitality industry can be accessible to all.
Including those new entrepreneurs, representing different cultures just starting out who don't have $600,000 to string together just for that that first permit. We're looking to support, the economic opportunity model by so many across the state, bringing new businesses in and ensuring that that touches everyone in our community. Boston is coming back. Our downtown foot traffic455 numbers are growing. Our retail vacancy rates are going down. But what we what we need to ensure is that this will be equitably felt by everyone. The licensing board last it last year issued more licenses in 2022 than in 2018 or 2019. So it's incredibly timely in this moment as businesses are looking to get back on their feet and new opportunities are coming to Boston that we would support the creation of new liquor licenses in the city non transferable ones to ensure that opportunity stays right in our neighborhoods.
I'm very supportive of the model that the city councilors and sponsors of this have put forward I know there's still further conversation and negotiation about the specific ZIP codes or neighborhoods that might be represented. As much as500 you're willing to give us, we would be eager to take because as a former restaurant504 owner, I understand very deeply that food is only one part, sometimes less than half of the equation, and it is really the alcohol license that can make the difference in terms of profit margins to keep those doors open for restaurants and for community members who benefit from them. So, I very respectfully request that this committee take favorable action to report it out to the full legislature for review and further discussion. We are eager and, grateful for your partnership to address this urgent economic opportunity issue. Thank you.
BRIAN WORRELL - BOSTON CITY COUNCIL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon. Chair Chan, chair Cronin, and honorable members of the committee. Thank you for hosting this hearing. Thank you to my co-sponsors, Councilor Louijeune, Councilor Arroyo. I also want to thank my, council colleagues who are here, and testifying and support council of Baker, Councilor Durkan, Councilor Coletta. Also want to just thank my team, for help in advance, this home root petition. And so many incredible community advocates who566 helped us get to this point. My name is Brian Worrell, and I represent Boston's District 4, which includes Dorchester Mattapan and small pieces of Jamaica plain in Rosendale. And I'm the original co-sponsor of this home group petition, which was unanimously passed by the council. Despite only having half percent of Boston's population, the South boss's waterfront has more than 15% of liquor licenses in the city.
Meanwhile, Dorchester houses over 14% of all Bostonians yet has less than 3% of the liquor licenses. This pattern repeats itself across Mattapan, high part, Roxbury and East Boston. Collectively home to 40% of the city yet those neighborhoods have less than 4% of total liquor licenses. These disparities represent obstacle obstacles in developing destination neighborhoods throughout the city, vibrant diverse communities that attract visitors not only from around the world, but also amenities that encourage Bostonians to venture outside their own neighborhoods. Entered this process with a clear understanding of two necessary goals. First, the new licenses should be designed to create economic and cultural hub and parts of the city, long ignored. And second, they should minimize any impacts of the secondary market.
As a result, this home rule petition has been carefully crafted to be highly specific and targeted. Finding a realistic pathway to create new licenses requires solving problems found with previous efforts. Those proposals released licenses into specific neighborhoods, but were not required to remain within that area, which meant that many licenses migrated to other neighborhoods. Current legislation ties new licenses a677 highly verifiable manner. This ensures that the areas of highest need could be more precisely targeted. Finally, the proposed legislation preserves community engagement processes, while providing multiple license options requested by local entrepreneurs. Current interests suggest696 that a BlueHillLab.gov.in Maverick Street currently devoid of dining and entertainment options may soon be a distant memory. Many of the residents in my district and in other ZIP709 codes that would be affected by this on often restaurant workers or patrons.
While the current state of the MBTA and traffic their options for getting downtown are either expensive or difficult. These residents want and deserve driving restaurants in their own neighborhood. And these restaurants can also act as a community heartbeat providing gathering spaces and increasing foot traffic in the evening. Would like to thank you for having me here today and for granting me the opportunity to share my thoughts on this issue. And I look forward to working with you on legislation and welcome any questions you might have, and I respectfully request the committee issue a favorable report so the full legislature can review and pass this important economic development legislation.
RUTHZEE LOUIJEUNE - BOSTON CITY COUNCIL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you.762 And, thank you, Councilor Worrell and Mayor Wu. Dear chair Cronin and chair Chan and esteemed members of768 the body. My name is Ruthzee Louijeune, and I'm an at large city council representing all of Boston and an original co-sponsor of the homo petition before you. I am grateful for778 all of the community members, all the restaurant owners, and aspiring restaurant owners who are782 also here, those who hold, liquor licenses that they've purchased at fair market value and those interested in these restricted licenses that are before this body. As someone born and raised in Mattapan, I am disheartened every time someone me where can I go sit down in Mattapan and have dinner and a drink because the answer is nowhere?
So I am here801 today to show you how to make a nine part delicious drink recipe for growth community and equity by adding more liquor licenses in Boston. First, you start with your base spirit of community economic success. Sit down restaurants as my colleagues have stated are not just places to enjoy a drink and a meal. They are vital components of neighborhoods and communities and are strong engines. They bring people together foster a sense of belonging and create space for social interaction. These826 neighborhood restaurants contribute significantly to828 the local economy by providing jobs and attracting visitors.831 By increasing the number of neighborhood restricted liquor licenses, we encourage the growth of sit down restaurants enhancing community bonds and fostering economic success and historically marginalized and excluded areas.
Second, mix in some financial845 viability. Local licenses are essential for making sit down restaurants financially viable. They allow restaurants to offer a full range of dining experiences from fine wines to craft cocktails, which can significantly increase their revenue. In an industry with notoriously slim profit margins, literacy can make our tours to open and to and sustain their businesses. Many of them are here with us today. Third, strain for inequity. The current liquor licensing system in Boston presents numerous challenges. The high cost of licenses effectively restrict them to well-funded, well-connected, often corporate and often white operators, especially in high traffic areas like the Seaport in downtown. We've seen a number of licenses lost from JP going to the Seaport.
This system not only limits opportunities for aspiring restaurant owners, but also exacerbates inequity in the industry. By expanding access, we can level the playing field, allowing entrepreneurs of color, women, and immigrants to participate in Boston's vibrant restaurant scene. Fourth, chill for the zero sum game. The current system operates as a zero sum game. Each new establishment in areas like the Seaport often means the closure of a restaurant elsewhere. This creates a competitive environment where growth in one neighborhood comes at the expense of another. In every area of policy, I do not, and I simply reject the zero sum game. By introducing more liquor licenses,932 we can break the zero sum cycle and promote growth throughout the city without displacing existing businesses.
Five, add a secret ingredient like restricted neighborhood licenses. Restricted942 neighborhood licenses have proven to be944 a successful approach. These licenses allow for controlled growth while protecting the interest of existing unrestricted license950 holder establishments. They952 do not negatively impact non-restricted licenses on the secondary market as we've seen when councilor Presley now congresswoman Pressley advocated for them as a market has also shown ensuring a fair and balanced approached expansion. Sixth shake for job creation and economic impact. Beyond their role as community hubs, sit down restaurants are vital economic engines. They provide employment973 opportunities from chefs to wait staff and kitchen staff. Additionally, these establishments support a network of suppliers.
Including farmers, wineries, breweries further bolstering the local economy. Seven, poor for a level pay playing field. As I've stated, the current liquor licensing system disproportionately favors those who have access. This model stifles diversity and creativity that independent and culturally unique restaurants can offer by1000 expanding access, we enable a more inclusive array of entrepreneurs to bring their innovative concepts to life in reaching the culinary landscape. eight, add a dash of innovation. More liquor licenses can create to can lead to greater culinary innovation. On maneuvers who might have otherwise been deterred by the exorbitant cost of licenses can now experiment with creative menus and concepts. This can lead to a broader range of dining experiences for residents and visitors alike.
Attracting a more diverse clientele and making Boston a more appealing destination. nine, garnish with balanced growth. A significant drawback of the current system is the concentration of restaurants in downtown and affluent neighborhoods, leaving our other neighborhoods behind. By issuing more licenses and adopting a neighborhood focused approach, Boston can encourage balance growth. This means that the benefit of dining establishments will be more evenly distributed throughout the city helping to re revitalize underappreciated neighborhoods and encourage residents to explore their own communities. I also want to thank the sustained for passing our previous homo petition last session granting five additional liquor licenses for the bowling building and Strand Theatre in Roxbury and Door Chester.
This is exactly what we are trying to do here today and expand on, supporting our historically neglected neighborhoods, too often black and brown, that have been under invested and underestimated. In conclusion, advocating for more liquor licenses in Boston is not just about supporting the restaurant industry. It's about building stronger communities, generating economic opportunities, creating balanced growth, growth, and addressing longstanding inequities. Well considered expansion of liquor licenses like the home world petition before you can serve to make Boston a more vibrant, equitable, and prosperous place for all residents and, hopefully, one day, I'll be able to tell someone that they have a sit down restaurant in Mattapan where they can also grab a drink. It's time for us all to toast to a more inclusive and responsive for all. Cheers.
REP CHAN - Thank you very much for your testimony. Mayor Wu, we do have some questions from the committee, but, first off, with a record, you have never spoken to myself, nor Chair Cronin, about these liquor licenses before today. Is that correct?
WU - I apologize if the expectation was to make a call ahead of time, behind closed doors. I'm learning my ways in the state house, and we'll do my best, to take whatever actions you need. I'm appearing here today. I very rarely, have the chance to come and test I in person at the state house, so I really wanted to show my, deep support and respect for this committee in doing so, as well as to thank my colleagues for moving this forward. Happy to give you a call anytime representative1161 if that's important to this process.
CHAN - Well, Madam Mayor, the most important thing, as you said, is not behind closed doors. So we're very thankful for an open and transparent process and your time to come here.
WU - Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - It's very important to us. We're, committee is open to questions. I'm going to represent of Howard, you're up first.
REP HOWITT - Thank you, and thank you for coming in today. I guess my first question, having been a selectman in one of my towns that I represent, liquor licenses always were coming before us. So my first question, what is Boston Charge for a fee annually when they renew a liquor license.
WU - Let me try to find that before the end. If we go to other questions, I'll make I'll just quickly look it up, but it's something very, very small in this. I want to say it's, like, 1500. Okay. Phone a friend. 25100 for all alcohol.
HOWITT - Okay. And how many unrestricted licenses do you presently have in Boston.
WU - How many total unrestricted license? Approximately 200.
HOWITT - And how many restricted licenses?
WU - The nontransferable licenses? 2200. Is it is it the other way around? The other way. 2200 total licenses and about 200 restricted licenses.
HOWITT - 2000 restricted licenses and.
WU - 2000 unrestricted licenses and about 200 restricted ones. Those have only been added really in the decade or so.
HOWITT - Okay. And, unfortunately, due to COVID, a lot of restaurants, went out of business. And of those restaurants that had licenses. I'm just curious where they turned back in, where they sold, and how many were there that, are inactive. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER8 - Since.
SPEAKER9 - Presently, it would be other thing.
SPEAKER1 - Actually, yeah, it'd be easier if you bring your team up, madam mayor, and, take a microphone. So whoever got in, in the room, madam mayor, I can't, can you suggest to just bring them straight up to the mic and just introduce themselves? IT. Is there all the microphones available, on the down there or the all live? Yeah. All the microphones are live. So just help yourself to a microphone.
LESLEY DELANEY HAWKINS - PRINCE LOBEL TYE LLP - Alright. Apologies, Leslie Delaney Hawkins, with Prince Lobel, during, COVID, while those licenses did become inactive, non were turned in to my knowledge. I am an attorney in the space. I was previously the executive secretary to the licensing board before I came into private practice, and I've been working closely with the mayor, her administration, Councilor Worrell, Councilor, Louijeune and this team. Because for value licenses are an actual legal asset in order for a license that is not being used to be canceled. It is it is a legal process. I do know that the licensing board has put, just by way of practicing in the space, put those licensees who are not actively using their licenses on notice and is holding, nonuse hearings to resolve that nut, and I you'll hear plenty of testimony about the market as it exists now. The demand for licenses is higher than we have ever in the city of Boston, and I can say that as a practitioner.
HOWITT - Are your licenses that are restricted, they cite specific
HAWKINS - Their neighborhood restricted. So this legislation is slightly different than the prior iterations and all of the prior iterations from the 2006 legislation and the 2014 legislation have actually been issued. The difference with this legislation, which I think is very import and a very important distinction, is that these licenses don't just go to a qualifying neighborhood or a qualifying ZIP code. They're actually targeted. So what we saw with the 2014 legislation yes, Mattapan was a qualifying neighborhood, so was Dorchester, so was Roxbury. So all of those licenses went out to those neighborhoods who had people ready to go. Once issued to one of those neighborhoods, they had to remain in that neighborhood. So they revert if a business closes, even if it's at the same location, they reverted back to the licensing board and could go out to the same neighborhood.
But the problem there was that ate off all of the licenses that Mattapan would have qualified, right, because there were so many businesses ready in the other qualifying neighborhoods. And that's why I think the mayor and the counselors have done such a very, as standing job in targeting this, but also learning from the lessons of the past and saying, okay, if it's five licenses for the Mattapan ZIP code per year that can only go to Mattapan. Those can't, if they're not issued because there's no applicant or the licensing authorities do not deem any proposal before them to meet the public need, those stay with Mattapan. Those can't go to Dorchester. Those can't go to East Boston. So that's why this legislation was very narrowly tailored, to ensure that we're learning from, you know, kind of some of the challenges that we've seen in the past.
HOWITT - Would you be adverse assuming these licenses were granted that they would be non-transferable and that once they were given up would not be able to be sold, they would have to revert back to the licensing board.
WU - That's the intent?
HAWKINS - Yep. That's the intent.
WU - That's where the language is.
HOWITT - Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - A representative of.
REP LEBOEUF - Great. Thank you, Madam Mayor, and Councilors. My question is concerning the process that you have internally around these licenses. So you know, I used to be a small business advisor before, and I actually worked in, Roxbury, right by Newby and Square. And sometimes when you see new businesses come in, they're not necessarily owned by residents of the neighborhood, and kind of, you know, for lack of a better term, have more of a gentrification agenda. So I'm kind of curious, you know, what is the internal process to make sure that you're not going to see similar pattern, you know, although the licenses are not transferable, like, the secondary market, but that they're actually going to be accessible to some of these local business owners that have been restricted in the past and not going to be bought up by some company out of New York or, you know, an affiliate of MGM or something like that.
WU - I will mention that city of Boston's chief of economic opportunity and inclusion, Segun Idowu is here also so I’m sure he would have much to say on this topic but just big1554 picture, it's been really important to us in any action that we take to try to create more1558 opportunity, whether it's bus lanes1560 or development or liquor licenses, that we're also, as you say, really focused on the stabilization so that the benefits go directly to residents. That's why this wouldn't be the only action that we're taking, the, administration and partnership with the council has funded a tremendous amount of programs that are going directly to help prepare, provide technical assistance, and get restaurants ready. We have our space grant program issued the first round of funding to entrepreneurs, Boston based.
Many vast majority, people of color who are, look who would then get support to expand and do the build out of the space because we know there are many big that tend to become barriers. But one feature of this legislation, I think, is really important. And, again, based on lessons from the past is that in previous years, whoever was ready first would grab those licenses and there weren't enough, and it would tend to support that very, trend that you're talking about because these are kind of spaced out annually, and there are so many more tagged by each neighborhood rather than just generally a, quote, unquote, main streets area. The focus is really going to be how do we quickly get our own restaurant owners and entrepreneurs ready while, we can prepare and plan for this timeline that this provides us a kind of sustainable stream over the next couple of years. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Do you guys want to add anything?
WORRELL - Yeah. I agree with, what, Mayor Wu has said, and that's why we decided to, lay it out over five years, is to give them, restaurant owners that are looking to come to market that timeline to plan, and also with the support of the city, we're open that, you know, we'll be able to get those entrepreneurs up and ready, year after year.
LEBOEUF - Just one follow-up question. Does has the council or, the licensing commission ever, considered something like a residential preference, or some type of ranked, process to make sure that, again, that there are more guardrails in place that the Paul is meaning the intention, of kind of what is what is being it asked for.
WU - And I will mention that our current licensing board chair, I believe, is trying to log on to participate virtually at some point. So, chair dress will have a lot to say on that front as well. We feel pretty bound by the, parameters within state law. There's sort of a window as, Leslie was saying in the character and fitness determination to try to add some of that, but because1713 this is really state parameters that we are following through on, it would be great to, be able to do some of that, but we might have to come to you later on in in, with specific language for a home rule to be able to do that. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Representative Moschino.
REP MESCHINO - Oh, thank you so much. I following up on, Rep LeBoeulf's question, because that's really where my brain was sort of headed for, was hoping to hear more about your economic development plan for each of those ZIP codes, but not just the ZIP codes, really what are the concrete programs and investments that you're making, there are rules around how licensing boards, must you have to be fair and equitable, and you people come, and if there's a license available, you may not say no if they're qualified applicant. So in my mind, you know, your attorney suggested that there was something different about this bill from last time, but I, guess, I don't see it So I was hoping you could do is share a little bit more about what your actual, economic plans are.
And I guess the back side of that question implied there is why wouldn't you come to us when you have I was thinking back last session in Nubian Square. You know, it's concrete. It's building. There's people. There's economic investments.1794 There's development. There's programs. It's coming forward. And it's very much tangible, whereas this feels like it's just more for whoever comes along first. And even though you're trying to space it out over time. The fact the matter is it still comes down to who's ready first and who comes to you first and who's qualified first. So I just was hoping you could talk with a little bit more detail about what your plans are and how you see this working. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER2 - Absolutely. Oh, Shagreen, do you want to start?
Oh, there we go.
SEGUN IDOWU - CITY OF BOSTON - Good afternoon. Committee members. So Segun Idowu, chief of economic opportunity and inclusion for the city of Boston. It's a pleasure to be here. And thank you, Rep Chan, for hosting this hearing. Thank you for the question, madam representative. So it's important to note that I think the difference between now and previously is that this particular legislation is not divorced from all the other conversations happening in the city. For instance, you may have heard the mayor announce a couple of weeks ago at the Greater Boston Chamber of Commerce, a Squares and Streets Initiative, which is the city's, movement toward zoning and planning for our neighborhood commercial course.
You know, and this is also tied to things like planned Mattapan and other plans that have been1869 released, which are entirely meant to make sure that as we are looking at1873 our neighborhoods that we are identifying, what are1875 the places that could be, restaurants1877 or other types of, locations that would take advantage of these licenses so that as these are becoming available, we have places to put them. The problem the last time, for instance, I'll take Mattapan as Councilor noted is that the licenses were available, but we hadn't the city had not identified what could be the potential places for these licenses to be used. It's a completely different process and framework, where we are right now.
WU - And can I just dig one deep dive further into the legal language here? What the chief is saying is exactly how, I'm, I'm very grateful that the sponsors have written this. Last time around, there was a certain number. I think it was something like 75 licenses for Main streets areas, and there was a map. And if you were in these certain corridors, you were in a main street area, there was no specific tagging of each license to a particular neighborhood that is a main street area. So once one of those licenses went, it could be shifted around anywhere within a pretty large geographic area that was basically just not downtown. And so these are tied to the specific ZIP code, not only to qualify for them, but they will stay there even if a business no longer needs that license. Unlike the last time around where it was just a very broad category and you had to meet that threshold.
But then it could go anywhere within that area. So that that I think is a key distinction here. And then secondly, just in terms of the bowling building and that license for Jazz Urbane versus this batch, we could not wait to do it thoughtfully and comprehensively when some of the, the ones from last time around came up. And, you know, I think our goal always is to try to make the most use of your time and to present our strategy holistically but those were developments that were already they're at they were being held back by not being sure if the license would come or not. And it did there's such a long time lag in terms of when home rules can be written passed by the council sent up to you. I mean, when was this filed early in the term? Last year sometime. So from early in 2022 until now, we're still wondering what exactly we will get and crossing our fingers and for restaurant owners to plan, they really need much more clarity.
And predictability on whether a license will be available. There might be people who are going to there might be some who will put their concept together and then just wait and wait, but they're like most likely paying rent, losing money, and they're just going to go somewhere else and do something else with their energies if we're not sure that a pool of reliable licenses exists. And frankly, from the neighborhood perspective, I hear very much that we want to have that triple win of local amenity, local owned, and, you know, plugging back into the city of Boston. But some of, as, as you heard from the counselors, some neighborhoods right now have no sit down restaurants whatsoever. And we want it to be a locally owned 1, but at this point, we want to whoever's ready, we2056 will support them, and we will get our neighborhood restaurant owners ready at the same time.
HAWKINS - Thank you. And, Madam Mayor, if could just elaborate representative from the licensing authorities' perspective. And I know Chairwoman Joyce is going to be joining and will probably more articulate than I am, but there is a legal standard. So just because you're applying for a license that you might qualify for, does not mean that you're granted that license. And I know Chairman Chan knows this in incredibly well that this is a highly regulated industry. When a licensing authority, whether it's Boston or anywhere else, the state is evaluating a proposal they look to public need. And that includes community support. That includes what the concept is.
That includes what else in terms of density of restaurants is in and liquor licenses in the neighborhood. If potential impact ranging from traffic to trash to noise, and then the character and fitness of the applicant. So the bypassing this legislation, you actually give the licensing authority the ability to really make those determinations. Because if I come in and I'm proposing Leslie's restaurant in Mattapan, but it's not a good concept. They have that discretion to say no. And I think that's a very important point and one that gets a little bit lost, but this is not a guarantee that someone's going to get a license. This is just simply creating the tools so that the city doesn't have to keep coming back and asking for more license.
MESCHINO - So, just to follow-up on that, having been a select board member for a number of years and issued a number of these licenses, in theory, yes, that's correct, but that is not necessarily the way it works. And if you have a license in the drawer and someone comes along, and it doesn't necessarily fit with what the Select board is thinking, or in this case, the city of Boston, you have to be really articulate about why you're saying no to somebody who's actually a valid applicant. And let's be honest, most people that come along are actually, you know, you know, everyone says, well, character and fitness, but most people who are coming for and have that So, you know, I don't think this is, in my humble opinion, I want to hear more about how you see this working playing itself out because I think we're basically, what we're going to end up doing is giving you more, and the people who are ready now will come forward.
And I'm just going to take this to remind you that, I love the way you're talking about restaurants and neighborhoods, but the reality is I could come along and be a night club. And you might find that, not all of these licenses would have to just go to restaurants and the kinds of investments that it takes to shift from, say, like, just a bar concept in all bars over towards more foodie and restaurants and family oriented takes a lot of time and energy and investments in those neighborhoods so that people are ready to receive that.2233 I mean, I always think about secretary Jay Ash always says, you can ask for all the money you want unless you're ready to receive it. What good will it do? And that's what I'm thinking about here is I just haven't heard anything yet, specific and concrete about what those investments are going to be. So I just that was sort of where my brain was circling as a former it in, eager to hear more from your direct your director of development and your chief?
IDOWU - Well, I mean, I I'll just say too, you know, at least to the point making sure people are ready. I think the committee will hear testimony later on from folks who are ready. I see a lot of business owners who are here in this room who have been waiting for, more licenses to be available via our licensing board here in the city of Boston. And everything that our small business team is doing2278 is to build up our businesses in a2280 way that they are prepared to take these licenses. What we don't want to do, and I see there, president of, the Black Economic Council of Massachusetts, or BECMA that, we don't want to put people in a position to and so completely hear your point about, you know.
We'll have these available and then everyone will rush to get them, but they're not ready. Our2299 intent everything we've been doing as an administration for the last 20 months has been to build up businesses so that they can take advantage of this opportunity. Again, the mayor mentioned the space program, up to $200,000 that's being, given to businesses to not only help them identify a space, but build their capacity. Other programs that we'll be launching, not yet. I don't want to make any breaking news here today. But we'll be launching shortly. Again, are meant to help build the capacity of businesses so that, again, to your point, we are not setting folks up to fail just having people rush, who are not prepared.
WU - If I could just add, there is some ability to distinguish between those in terms of the types of licenses and entertainment being a whole separate category of, permitting and licensing that has its own separate hearing as well. So there's some ability to distinguish, but I want to just emphasize in many neighborhoods of Boston,2351 we need more of all of the2353 above. We need more night clubs. We need more entertainment venues, and we need more restaurants. So it's not as if we kind of are at a baseline, and we're just hungry to add some of this or some of that.
We are, I believe, in such dire need of licenses across the board that we very well may be coming back to you in, in the future as we, we see where these go. But our efforts across the board at the city level are really to it sounds like aligned very exactly with where your questioning is going in terms of the purpose and the, the doubling down and the, the multiplicative effect when local businesses and entrepreneurs really tap into a concept that the neighborhood desires. I I'm confident that with this first threshold and first set of permits, we'll be able to get, we'll be able to make some significant headway on that. And, very likely we will we will need more as the success grows.
REP MCKENNA - Thank you, Mr. Chair. And I'll preface my question by pointing out that for several terms now, I have, filed a piece of legislation that would return all liquor license control to the municipalities, including to Boston, much to the chair's chagrin that I keep pushing that bill. So I come from a place of believing that local control within the cities and towns is best, and you know your communities and you know all of the decision making. With that being said, I, I see this bill in 250 over the course of five years is a very large number of, of new license and I know that you've, you've talked some about the economic plan and the decision making behind that, but I'm wondering if you can expand on a little bit on, you know, you've got 10 different ZIP codes.
Do you know that there's going to be a demand for 25 licenses within those 10 ZIP codes? Or you know, is, is there going to be a situation where one may have that demand and one may not? And I do appreciate, the, the carryover in the bill and the reason for putting in five per year over a period of time to have a kind of a gradual roll out versus putting them all upfront. And I think that does make some sense. But to counter that, you know, if you had seven2489 applicants in year one, do two of those carry over and automatically take the first two spots in year two? And, you know, is there a concern of someone getting in the queue early just to get in the queue early and blocking someone out who may be you know, taking their time to put their business plan together, but because 10 other applicants have filed the paperwork and gotten in queue, they're blocked out down the road.
IDOWU - So if I can and then, of course, I welcome my colleagues to answer this question. So, at least to the question about, do we know that there is a demand I'll give to response to this.2523 one is that our licensing team, and I believe2525 Chairwoman Joyce may actually be on the call now2527 to answer, any technical questions on the licensing board, is keeping track of who are coming in, who are requesting these licenses as well as our 20 different Main streets continue to keep records of folks who are reaching out looking to open something in the area. I will say though, as point number 2, that the, the fact that pretty much all of our, city council is represented here today, think kind of shows that there is a demand in these particular neighborhoods, that we are asking for licenses, but I'll get to my colleagues.
LOUIJEUNE - Yeah. Thank you, chief. I think that was the point that I wanted to make, I think, back when rep, Meschino, when you were asking your questions. So hopefully, I will answer it both again, as an at large city councilor going from neighborhood to neighborhood, I know that there is a deep need for this. We have restaurants. And again, you will hear testimony. We have entrepreneurs. You know, one of the first projects that my office engaged in when I when my first term was restaurant tours in Mattapan and wanted to know what was2581 possible and me having give them an answer that I don't like to give, which is we can't do anything for you.
So we do know that there are people, there are rest there are entrepreneurs who are ready to move once they get the green light. And I think the staggered nature of this home rule petition is really, a smart one to get at sort of the questions that you were talking about. You know, I don't think any good policy is reacting to what community wants and what community needs as everyone knows, and this wouldn't be before you if we weren't to people coming to us, banging down our doors, saying that there is this need. Right? And, again, we put this out there, and there have been reactions to it, and they react to it have only shown that we need more.
Why is it no 2130 when they are, where JP is losing a lot of their liquor license? And then we heard from San Antonio, and we hear this all of the time. We have great bakeries that want to expand and have really great ideas. They're cooked bakery in Jamaica plain. They're a bakery that you go on a Saturday or Sunday, the line is down the block and around the corner. They have really great expansion ideas that they like to expand on, but for access to a liquor license that is cost prohibitive. Give. So it's not just putting it out there into the open and seeing what comes back. We know what's going to come back,2648 and we are hoping that you will help us advance this and help us meet that community need.
WORRELL - Yeah. And I'll just echo what Councilor Louijeune said. Our office has done surveys on already existing businesses. That are weighed in and eager, for this legislation to pass. And these are businesses that have been just doing just takeout for 18 years that might have the space, to add, you know, sit in dining and a liquor side to it, but there's no liquor life is available. And this will add not only, you know, more jobs, increase revenue. And we know that2683 when, you know, businesses, in the community, are getting more revenue that they start to reinvest in their neighborhood as well. So this is what we're encouraging, and there's already a demand. We've done some groundwork, done some surveys, and businesses already. This?
WU - Can I just, just on the rep's question? And maybe Chair Joyce, could confirm this, but my understanding is that it's2704 not first come first serve when there's no licenses left. It's not a queue that just gets established. And then whenever one is available, it kind of goes to the next person unless there's some reason. It really is each available license is decided based on, the applications that are before it. Kathleen, are you on?
KATHLEEN JOYCE - BOSTON LICENSING BOARD - I am on. Thank you. I'm not sure you can hear me, but thank you, Mayor. The Mayor is absolutely correct. We don't have a queue. We don't have a wait list. We have a pool of applicants that have, appeared before us within a certain amount of time that we look to when a license becomes available. We go through our analysis of public need and what the needs are of that particular neighborhood. What I can say is words gotten out that Boston doesn't have any consistent about.
So we're not seeing the applications, which I think is pushing people into the private market. I think if we could get the word out, that there we want more licenses. More licenses are coming our way. We would see the demand in these neighborhoods and in the downtown for other restaurant owners to apply for different the concept. So we don't have2767 a list. We don't have, you2769 know, a waiting list. And I think the narrative out there is that Boston doesn't have any. So people are discourage from even going through the time consuming process until they know for sure that they can rely on something at the end. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Representative raise.
REP REYES - Thank you, Mr. shared. Thank you all for coming forward and testify and support this bill. My question is straightforward. By no mean, I want to take you as, against this bill. But my question is, you know that, additional license licenses is requiring more, police officer, public safety. Is any plan that you have in mind, or the business owner is also going to be part of pay for that resources.
WU - And I'll defer to chair Joyce. Also, if, she wants to add anything as the kind of primary oversight mechanism, but the licensing board does a great job working very closely with the Boston Police about when complaints might be issued and how they're investigated and followed up on. We are very aware that the city has been having more big events and more vibrancy and more economic opportunity and have been therefore boosting our, police recruit classes accordingly. There, I've just visited our latest a class at the academy, and there's so many of them that they don't even fit into the classroom anymore. They're in the gym with all desks lined up, and so we're very eager. I think it's 134, new officers will be hitting the streets in just a couple weeks in October.
And then we'll roll right into having another large class. But we have been investing to make sure our, public safety, community, safety, and all of our departments are working very closely to maintain that baseline for everyone, including in the economic opportunity, sphere. I will also add that oftentimes what we hear from neighborhoods is that having more businesses does create more safety, that it is in fact the vacant storefronts and the quiet streets that make it so that people kind of have to look over their shoulder. And, and when there's vibrancy, when there's people coming in and out, eyes on the street, that is sometimes the best way to ensure that everyone feel safe and active together.
REYES - Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Representative Howard.
HOWITT - Thank you. With such a number, I've my I guess my first question is, how many packaged stores do you have in, boss and licenses, full licenses, and then be just be your unwind licenses. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER2 - Kathleen, do you take that 1?
JOYCE - Yep. Give me one minute. We're just pulling up those numbers. I know we haven't met our quarter in Boston. We have 250 all alcohol off premise retail licenses and 320, wine and malt.
HOWITT - Okay. The reason I'm asking that is I don't want restaurants to go in competition with packaged stores. Now as you're2982 aware, during COVID, you were allowed2984 to have take out liquor. And so I guess my question would be2988 if this policy were to continue would you restrict takeout of alcohol on these new licenses? SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER2 - Several years ago. Oh, sorry. Go ahead, Kathleen.
JOYCE - I think we would follow what the state does on that. I think it served a benefit during COVID, and we would follow your lead to see how, it was impacted economically in the neighborhood departed the mayor. I know she's put a lot more thought into some of this particular issue.
WU - Yeah. I totally agree. And I was just going to add one other point around trying to make the most did a BYOB ordinance for the first time. It's not it hasn't come into sort of it's not you know, we don't have quite have the scene yet that some cities around the country do with BYOB but it's meant to fill a segment of the market where there might be some of those takeout restaurants or breakfast and lunch service where they could stay open, if people brought their own drinks with them. So we are trying to do everything we can to make sure that, we're not undercutting different parts of the industry and the economy, but you know, as you hear and as you hear in our neighborhoods, we are at such a need that we're it's not close to coming in to competition. There are very few places in the city, just probably two or three neighborhoods where the density is such that, we see neighborhoods asking for not to increase the number of licenses, and those are not included in the ZIP codes that are here.
HOWITT - So in other words, no would be the answer?
WU - My sense is that we will we will not do a, an additional restriction if the state law remains where it is, but that, certainly hasn't been decided by any policy at this point.
HOWITT - Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Thank you, Mr. Sure.
SPEAKER1 - We have vice chair Keith, on teams, vice chair Keith.
SPEAKER15 - Thank you. Can you hear me?
SPEAKER1 - Yes. We can.
REP KEEFE - Okay. Great. Mayor Wu, thank you very much, for bringing your team forward in being able to, field all of the questions that we're asking of you today. I'm Mary Keefe. I'm, representing the 15th Worcester District in advice chair of the committee. I guess, I'm trying to relate to this a lot of the neighborhoods that you're talking about are very similar to neighborhoods in my district. And this is a little bit different than licensure, but I guess, what I'm thinking about is like in many of the neighborhoods and neighborhood being a very sacred3155 thing that we're working hard to protect. Bringing in more licensure and restaurants sometimes can be viewed as the first step in gentrification. So I'd like to know how, and it seems like you are flexible when you're looking at neighborhoods, particularly and singularly. But how exactly are you going to be sensitive to some of the reactions that might happen around these kinds of changes. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER2 - Well I'll defer to our chief and jump in if
SPEAKER1 - necessary.
IDOWU - Well, thank you, vice chair, for the question. I think it has been indicated by, counselors and the mayor, you know, there's a real demand in these particular neighborhoods, which also happen. Majority are communities of color. And therefore, many of the owners are, people of color who reside in these neighborhoods. And so while broadly speaking, there may be a concern around, more restaurants or more licenses creating gentrification in the neighborhood. In this particular case, this is the neighborhood itself. These neighborhoods themselves coming to us requesting more licenses to bring more vibrancy to their neighborhood. And again, I'll note, most of, the folks that we're talking to are folks who live and work in these neighborhoods who were then also high hiring people3240 from these neighborhoods. And as we know,3242 if you're hiring people that live in the neighborhoods and paying fair wages, then people are able to afford to stay3248 in these neighborhoods. I hope that answers your question.
WU - Madam vice chair, I'll just add. I just thought of this and it touches on several of the questions that were by members of the committee, because the city has been using so, a significant chunk of our American Rescue Plan federal recovery dollars to specifically try to support and stimulate new entrepreneurship and small business. We have had several rounds of applications for assistance. Whether it's to form a new business or particularly for, support that's needed. And so we see when those applications come in just how many are on the wait list we couldn't give grants to, but are concepts that are ready to go. And then again, the interest is very much there. And it will take additional support in some of the programs that the council administration is working on together, but, we're doing all of that at once and see the liquor licenses as a very critical baseline for all of it to come together. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you, vice chair.
SPEAKER15 - Thank you very much.
SPEAKER1 - Thank you, vice chair. Repzilla Buff.
WU - Madam vice chair, I'll just add. I just thought of this and it touches on several of the questions that were by members of the committee, because the city has been using so, a significant chunk of our American Rescue Plan federal recovery dollars to specifically try to support and stimulate new entrepreneurship and small business. We have had several rounds of applications for assistance. Whether it's to form a new business or particularly for, support that's needed. And so we see when those applications come in just how many are on the wait list we couldn't give grants to, but are concepts that are ready to go. And then again, the interest is very much there. And it will take additional support in some of the programs that the council administration is working on together, but, we're doing all of that at once and see the liquor licenses as a very critical baseline for all of it to come together.
LEBOEUF - Thank you. And, so just one final question. So, you know, again, I represent the district very similar. Rep Keefe were actually our districts border each other. So that's kind of where I'm coming from this. And I've seen both in my previous profession and also in my district sometimes when there is a economic development that does just that thing where it extracts resources from some of the neighborhoods that need it. And I'm not saying that this bill does. I see exactly where you're coming from where it's talking about, you know, there has been a community to community demand. I guess my question that I I'm trying to grapple because, again, I come from Worcester. We have a very different we have a different system, the secondary market. I don't understand why the city hasn't tried to basically recapture those licenses that seem to work extracted from the neighborhoods and remove that type of practice, which seems to be more story and, you know, essentially affects the communities, that are looking for more licenses.
WU - Representative, I would wholeheartedly agree with you. I think if we were designing a system from scratch, it wouldn't be what we have today, but 400 years of history, and, and we're, we're trying to do our best to, add to what is there while recognizing that many, many people have poured in their life savings into the existing system and would be very much affected if we were to make drastic changes. There are license holders, for example, in some of the downtown neighborhoods where there's a density and have had joined the licenses that migrated to those areas, but they also have spent $500,000 of their own capital to be able to open. And if we were to suddenly say we are eliminating the private market by changing all of our transferable licenses to non-transferable licenses.
They've used those licenses as collateral already for financing for the rest of the restaurant and everything. So their savings would basically evaporate in that case. It has, I've, I've personally worked with some colleagues and tried to explore with different economists and others, all different models. There's, you know, systems where you could start to reverse auction back those licenses over time where slowly, you know, you kind of buy back the transferable licenses and reissue them as non-transferable in a in a at a pace where you don't kind of totally blow up the supply and demand of the situation, or you do some kind of deal for those who want to get out of their transferable licenses and this there's some public sort of compensation for that in a certain way.
Really, it would have been great to do this during the pandemic when the entire market was out of whack and values were all over the place but we, we are where we are today, and we're back to $600,000 for an all, full liquor license, unfortunately. And so It's just trying to balance respecting those who have already poured so much into this inequitable system so that they're not completely hurt by it. While adding more, so we adjust over time. That's why this targeted approach is more complex than it probably needs to be. If we could wave a magic wand, we wouldn't ideally have licenses that are now administratively needing to be tracked to every single ZIP code, but this is the way to guarantee that people don't lose their original investments in other parts of the, the market while we address the gaps that exist.
HAWKINS - And, and, madam, mayor, if I could just add to that, I have the unique perspective having been in a regulatory position and now being in private practice. And I know you're going to hear from my colleague, Steve Miller, who's been doing this for decades as well. We wouldn't be here to testify support of this if we thought this was devaluing the secondary market. It would be an ethical breach. Right? I represent many individuals who hold four value licenses. And I can sit here and say, working with the mayor's office, with the counselors, with the city, with the state, to very narrowly tailor this, we believe and I know we have Councilor Flaherty, Councilor Baker, Councilor Murphy.
This was unanimously passed, and you don't see that with liquor licensing bills in Boston as I think everyone here knows. We haven't seen a devaluation from the 2014 licenses from which actually included four value licenses. We haven't seen a devaluation from the 2006 or from the prior airport licenses. As Mayor Wu mentioned, these are actual collateral, just like a mortgage, right, people have pledge these3584 licenses for funds to build out their restaurants. These are an asset. And I think this legislation as3590 how it's written and with ZIP codes. These aren't going to the north end. They're not going downtown. That is simply not an option, and the language has built in suspenders to ensure that doesn't happen.
I don't think you would see kind of the broad support in the restaurant industry. And I know you're going to hear four from liquor license holders, both restricted and unrestricted later on. We wouldn't be here if we thought there was an issue of devaluation, and we want to make sure, you know, as the case counselor mentioned, that is one of the priorities here is to create these licenses that are not a barrier to entry, especially for BIPOC establishments in neighborhoods that are currently underserved, but to also make sure that those individuals who've invested their life savings, that those aren't being devalued. And I think the fact that you're seeing so many people here in support, ranging from elected officials to restaurateurs really speaks to that. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Representative in Moschino?
MESCHINO - So just going back to that point, I guess where my head is stuck. You don’t have to answer this question if you don't want to, but, what I'm taking away from this is that there are licenses out there that it worth $600,000 that somebody's holding on to, that somebody can't afford to buy, that are laying fallow and not being used, and the I have not yet heard anyone in the city of Boston say, how are you then trying to get those back? And I, you know, Madam Mayor, I really was paying attention when you were saying about the buyback process and the fact that people have laid out money, and I understand the secondary. I really do understand secondary market. But at the end of the day, once you get that license, you are legally obligated to use it.
And if you don't use it within a certain period of time, then it reverts back and the city is obligated, or it's up to the city and says city is obligated, it is up to the city to, have their hearings and to take back those licenses that aren't being utilized. And I guess3707 that was that's the piece that hasn't been filled in from me yet. So I'm not sure there's a question in there, but that's the piece I'm I just wanted to say out loud that that's the piece I'm listening for is what is the city of Boston's actions to take back the licenses that are hanging out there for the someone's just waiting for the p the big payback on that investment. And that's the piece I'm waiting to hear because they do have a little obligation no matter how much money they've paid for, or how much value has accrued to it. And I think that's where my brain is kind of circling around.
WU - Thank you. Chair Joyce would, be able to speak to this much more clearly. My understanding is that we don't have $600,000 licenses just floating out there being unused. They wouldn't be $600,000 if there were extra ones. So they are they are all being3756 used right now, and we believe that we could absorb more in other the only ones that tend to have a any gap at all in being picked up are the previous created nontransferable licenses. But even that, I don't know if, I don't know if there are any of those just available3772 either. Madam Chair.
JOYCE - Thank you. I do want to dispel this notion that we have all these licenses out there that are not, open and operating, I would3783 have to guess it's single digits. And here's a perfect example. During COVID, some places close because they weren't able to open at that time, and we asked them just to update us every six months. We would then have a non-use hearing. And if we thought that they weren't using their license in the way they should be, we would then take the license his back. Another example is, Blazes in my own neighborhood had a massive fire that destroyed the entire building. When that happens, the insurance money had to go to pay off debts of the owner it took them two to three years to get back on their feet. As a regulator, every six months, we checked in with the owner. What is going on? What is going on? That was being put to good use3822 in our eyes because they were working towards reopening.
I would not want to seize a license of a person that is of a restaurant that is trying to get back on their feet. And during COVID, we took a really soft touch with these licensees. We ask them to keep us informed. Every single year, there's a license renewal period, which we're now coming into, and that's when we will determine which licenses aren't being used. Maybe in the last five years, I've been in this position. There might have been one that came back to us where for whatever reason, a family decided that they no longer want to run this restaurant. They didn't have anyone else who wants to take it over. The license came back to us and we reissued it. It's less than five is my guess. But we will now find out in December when they renew if these licenses are going they're moving in the right direction to be reused or, if they need a couple more months to get back on their feet. So if we take a look at that every single time, there's not a ton of licenses out there that are going unused.
MESCHINO - Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Miss Mosquito, would you like to make a credit request at City of Boston for some more specific date on this matter?
SPEAKER11 - Well, yes, I would, Mr. Sherman. Thank you3885 very much.
CHAN - Rep Meschino’s staff will write down the question as follows. The question is how many Boston, licenses, alcohol licenses for, on establishment are currently not in use, to my knowledge, as well, madam mayor, as well as chief Joyce, that there are licensed held by landlords. It's always been my understanding as well. We'd like to know how many landlords have alcohol licenses. We also like to know how many of those license also not in use. We also like to know, the recovery effort by the city of Boston for these inactive instances.3916 We'd like to know the, recovery effort over the last decade, if possible, or as many years it can provide on that recovery effort. And, the mayor also mentioned that, actually last three or so years that you've done a record number license issuances. We'd like to know exactly how many licenses have been issued during the time period that Mary had mentioned, I believe, from 2018 on. Does that cover that Representative Meschino?
MESCHINO - Yes. Thank you. And thank you to chair Joyce for, walking us through that. I appreciate it.
CHAN - Leading, a leading offer that quickly, Chair Joyce. How many, licenses do you have that's pending applications before your licensing board?
JOYCE - I'd have to say maybe eight or nine pending, a license issue when we become available.
CHAN - So you have eight or 9, applications pending is what you're telling me?
JOYCE - Yes. That have applied for a license that the board determined there was a public need for a license at this particular neighborhood, but we didn't have any licenses available. We keep them active for about one year.
CHAN - I'm sorry. The microphone's having issues on my side. Alright. So you have, some pending licenses. I do understand that every penny license application is what I call ready to go. Do you often see, applicants that are, let's say, incomplete paperwork or not quite making, you know, ready yet and you guys help them out and getting them to where they need to be?
JOYCE - We wouldn't schedule them for hearing unless they were ready to go.
CHAN - So depending, licenses before you that are less than 10, are so called ready to go?4019
JOYCE - In my professional opinion, without having all this stuff before me, yes. These might be pre existing restaurants that would like to add alcohol to their menu that are open and operating and waiting for one to become available.
CHAN - Also following4038 that question, I'm aware of the 2014 law versus various neighborhoods. I'm aware that not everybody was here in 2014. Sadly, I was. So I am showing some gray hairs my health. So the, I suppose the concern has been presented by the testifiers today is that the way it was done is that even though there were, 75 art licenses for Dorchester, East Boston, Hyde Park, Jamaica Plain, Mattapan, Mission Hill, and Roxbury, as designated by the Bony Boston zoning Commission, also designated by the Boston University as Main Streets. They were issued more in a queuing up situation where as restaurants became available, those were pushed out or they were pending push out because it's my understanding. It moved out in fairly quick period.
JOYCE - I wasn't here in this role in 2014.
CHAN - Do you have records from 2014 on how those were issued?
JOYCE - We could go back through our old agendas.
CHAN - Alright. We let's have a record request by the committee to the chair Joyce regarding the 2014 license issuances regarding date locations, times, as well as who they went to and whether or not they're still active,4107 returned, or who's new issuances?
JOYCE - Sure. Do you have a time frame on that for us?
CHAN - We'll send you a letter. We'll give you a we'll work with you on time frame, but we'll put this in writing, hopefully, in a better sentence format that I just provided. But, you know, we do like to have that information because, to my understanding, we have 985, total Section 12 licenses 165 oil beverage, 321 in malt, over which the oil beverage, oil call licenses is 132. And is 26, Walton Wine, licenses that were by special legislation.4150 My understanding is 19, special situation licenses were provided as well, regarding reeconomic zones and restricted use. So, you know, part of the 75 is actually part of the general laws. We're talking about those specific neighborhoods as opposed to being a conditional special act. It's kind of, as we're pointing about the mayor, alcohol law is quirky and strange, through all the different communities. So we'd like to get a sense of, you know, what happened in the past so we can make some better determinations of what the committee considers for the future. Does that make sense?
WU - And Mr. chair, if I may, I just wanted to clarify. I apologize if I was, not specific with my language. When I mentioned earlier that the licensing board issued more licenses in 2022 than in 2018 2019, I didn't mean just liquor licenses. I was trying to refer to the sense that the city is really coming back and building back after the pandemic, but that was that was total licenses of every category.
CHAN - Alright. So we'll get the data set for the total licenses, Madam Mayor. That that makes it easy for us, you know, on the clarification. What else do I have here for the chief? Alright. Your, Chad Joyce, obviously, we'll be touching with you. We have more questions. Now I'll get the chief a whole bunch of questions we got to ask, following up. So, as we pointed out earlier, regarding myriad of questions provided by the committee members regarding issuers and licenses and the types of restrictions. Obviously, as, the council knows, this, legislation I've said, all kinds of creative ways on providing restrictions and protection of value. I've been taking a little bit of, email criticism by the general public about this valuation issue. So I'm very happy to hear that the city shares the concern of the chairs regarding the valuation issues of existing licenses. So, I so this goes back to the, again, the question to Chair Joyce regarding issues and licenses chief.
The speed of which these licenses were pushed out. Again, that's why we asked for the datasets because as you hit, there's only, like, under 10 people waiting or applied for licenses license ready. Right? So, you know, the idea, of course, is that you guys want to do 5, licenses per year for 25 over the course of five years for 25 total licenses. And, you know, one of the things that you're aware of is that we always ask for plans about where and where and how. Because, for example, you talked about Main Streets before, you know, you're doing ZIP codes now. You know, the language in, the law occurring has some neighborhoods plus other, city regulatory authorities, which can kind of decide what those lines are. The current statute doesn't say that Boston zoning commission can't change the lines. It doesn't say that. There's no specific to it. So I suppose that you have done studies, yourself, regarding the, readiness of various neighborhoods within the time period that you're looking for licenses.
IDOWU - I'm sorry. The question I have around studies.
CHAN - Studies regarding the readiness of businesses to go into those neighborhoods at a time period you ask for these licenses?
IDOWU - I think we would be happy to put something together for the committee to review.
CHAN - Alright. We will put down that as a record request for further conversation. Also, a question really comes about overlapping issues. For example, you have, a number of ZIP codes here to overlap with existing 2014 law. Did you take into account those existing licenses through the 2014 law? Which, by the way, statue allows you to move out of. So if it does if, let's say, you have a license that comes out of Dorchester, the city if there's a licensee ready in Mattapan, you could move it from Dorchester to Mattapan, for example. Have you taken into account that consideration when you put this bill together into 2014 laws? SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
About and I and I just want to say at the top, I don't know something with the I'm trying to make sure
Oh, I'm sorry. Are you trying to this is better?
Yes.
Alright. So let's not get too comfortable with the microphone.
IDOWU - But the question is about whether or not we've taken a consideration then moving from one neighborhood to another neighborhood?
CHAN - Well, the 2014 law states, specific neighborhoods get 75 licenses. And as you mentioned earlier, the expediency of those licenses being issued after law was put in place is what the record request to ask for from Chia Joyce. Correct?
IDOWU - Yes.
CHAN - So when you put this legislation together, did you take your account to 24 2014 law to move on the ability to move licenses within those neighborhoods, not just one area within those neighborhoods as dictated by the Boston zoning Commission and the Boston, Redevelopment Authority, whatever the business authority because you guys all control those lines, not the legislature. We set up the mechanism for you to do that now. The counselor can argue with Meyer's office regarding those lines, obviously. But have you, as part of your analysis on this home competition,4434 have you taken account the migration of licenses availability within the existing 2014 law.
IDOWU - Well, I think even within the question, noting that this is a home rule petition that something put together between, the administration and the city council. And, you know, I'm happy to welcome my colleagues to answer this question as well. But these are things that we are considering on our end Yes. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Alright. So yes. Go ahead.
WU - For better or worse, I'm one of those who has been around since, the 2014 ordinate or home rule petition along with you. So, I would say that the the proposal that has been put forward from the sponsors starts with the baseline of where we are today, of the exact number of licenses in in each ZIP code, in each neighborhood that have been shaped by the 2014 legislation, and, even the one prior to that but we've seen where those have gone. We know that once they're there, they're likely to hopefully, they'll stay there because those restaurants will continue to operate and stay there. We're not trying to see much movement.
And, it's not really a victory if we get to move one license to one part of the city because some other restaurant in a, in a different part of the city has shut down and, and people are mourning that loss in that area. So we're starting from having the map of where all of the existing4514 restaurants and license holders4516 are today that has been very much4518 determined by those 75 licenses from almost a decade ago, but we are, we are sure, that that we need more on top of that, given how that legislation functions and where those licenses would potentially go even if those restaurants were to close down.
CHAN - Well, is it possible to get the data regarding from 2014? Are those migration, the licenses within those areas?
IDOWU - Can look at whether or not that's possible.
CHAN - Request to committee staff to find out the migration of licenses for the 2014 licenses to see what what's been actually going on.
HAWKINS - And, Chair, if I may, the 20144549 license legislation, while it allowed those licenses to4553 initially go out to any of those qualifying neighborhoods that you listed as well as Main Street areas, the legislation reads that once issued to one of those neighborhoods initially, it has to stay in that neighborhood. So if was issued to Dorchester, it has to go if it's returned to the municipality, it has to go back to Dorchester. It can't just shift to the other, to another neighborhood. And that's distinct from the 2006 legislation, which was much fewer licenses, and those are permitted to go to any, qualified neighborhood. And that, was one of the purposes in the narrowly tailored language here?
CHAN - Yeah. We're of the 2006 language too, and, let’s focus on 14 first before I go back to 6. How's that sound? I think you already know what I'm getting So let let's see what the information you guys provide turn up before I go further back in time.
WU - And I will know, Mr. Chair, as well, I don't want to hog all the time with us here, although we are happy to entertain any other questions you have, through data requests or otherwise. There are several other city councilors here in attendance as well. I see city councilor Baker, Councilor Murphy4618 and Councilor Flaherty here as well.4620 In person, several of whom were around, in 2014 as well. And then, I'm told that counselor Gigi Coletta and Julia Mejia are online, available virtually as well.
CHAN - I appreciate it, madam mayor. However, these are hearing.
WU - I'm happy to stay as long as you'd like us to
CHAN - I appreciate your consideration, your colleagues, but, the committee chairs and the committee here are, it's our hearing. Thank you. Also, chief, I'd like to point out the fact that you use ZIP codes as party determination, for these neighborhood what happens when the post office changes the ZIP codes around in terms of geography?
IDOWU - If the post office changes the ZIP code?
CHAN - Well, the geographic lines for ZIP codes aren't static. The post office will change ZIP code lines. For example, in the city of Quincy, we actually have Milton ZIP codes. So when you look at4669 regarding the ZIP code configuration. I'm aware the city is pretty big in a borders' lot locations, but have you looked into the migration of the borders regarding ZIP codes over the years.
IDOWU - Yeah. I think these are all things that we can take into consideration.
CHAN - Alright. We can we can talk the office can talk to you more about how that works and what's going on. Yes. Go ahead.
LOUIJEUNE - I'll just say that I actually I live in a neighborhood that goes that there are there are a few places in Boston where there are changing ZIP codes. I live in one of them. I am in 02136 right now, which is technically High Park, 02126. Is Mattapan, neighborhood, again, that does not have a sit down restaurant with, where one can consume alcohol. But it's interesting when you look at concentration of the ZIP codes that we're talking about here today. A lot of them are in our neighborhoods that have been historically excluded in their margin So we are in the petition, even in a neighborhood like mine, which is one of the few neighborhoods where there are that was changing ZIP codes, we are looking for licenses for both 02126 and 02136 So, I mean, I think the scenarios in which that you may be concerned about, I think they're, they're very few, but because of the patterns of discrimination, a lot of the neighborhoods where there are those changing, where there could be changes, our neighborhoods that we, we care about both of them. So I just wanted to put that out there.
CHAN - Thank you very much. The, let me just do some final ones here to follow-up on, the, committee's inquiries. As been pointed out regarding these unused licenses and other concern that's been presented, by the committee that I'm going to ask. And know, we can always follow-up with more written requests is regarding, movement of licenses within certain geographic areas, in a sense. Let me give you the scenario to make more, understanding of what question I'm asking. So you have a area where you were going to propose restricted licenses within a ZIP code five. Is using a number for sake of ease.
And there's existing, licenses that are under quota in there. Let's say there's five. And those five inside the ZIP code under quota has the right to sell those licenses that we discussed early regarding the value. Right? So the concern that's been presented is that, that the five, ZIP codes that are, five licensees are under quota could potentially sell their license. An attempt. I'm not saying they will get it or not get it, and they attempt to try to get a new license proposed by this home rule petition. As part of your considerations, you know, and, because, again, the right evaluation, have you considered about how they would manage such a scenario?
HAWKINS - It chairman, I would having been on the board and seen this exact scenario, play out, I obviously would defer to chairwoman Joyce, but I believe it has been, and I was around in 2014 as well. So updating myself too. But I believe that has been the board's policy to not permit that that these licenses were not created for a windfall for someone to their license on the open market and obtain 1. But I would completely defer to Chairwoman Joyce.
SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Chair Joyce?
JOYCE - I would have to agree. Thank you.
CHAN - Okay. Okay. one really last 1. You point out the fact that, the mechanism we have today, with, chair Joyce on, we see a lot of flexibility regarding licensing. And the counselors and the mayor, as sure as the reps and senators are going to bring up to us the fact that many constituencies come asking specifically to the mayor of the council about license access, right? You've all been asked. I've been asked. Everyone here's been asked at one time. But the backstop for lack of better term is the Boston licensing board. Is that my understanding? Anyone? Yes. Okay. We got a yes here. So I think one of the in intriguing things about this entire legislation is the fact that while, there's a lot of advocacy here for the constituents, which is great, as well as business, which is great, the question is really the final authority will always be shared Joyce in the licensing board.
WU - Yes.
CHAN - And this, process will, ensure that it's absent of any political influence outside of the licensing board? So outside Mayor,4940 we could just get closer to the microphone?
WU - Yes. To all.
CHAN - Okay. So, Wow. The but the way and let's see if it works similar to what I'm understanding because every I know, over the years, we're working with all 100 communities on licensing issues. No one's the same. Can does the mayor office and the councilors advocate before the licensing board on behalf of others?
WU - That opportunity is available. These are open public hearings that anyone can advocate for.
CHAN - Alright. And has, well, you don't have to answer the question, but I I'm guessing everyone's done a letter at one time or some kind of advocacy before the licensing board at one point?
WU - Yes. Yes, Mr. Chair.
CHAN - Alright. So but and the chair joists, even though that the, individual, electives will advocate to you, you have final say regarding, whether a license is issued or not, or your commit4995 to a board does that.
JOYCE - The board, the three numbers of licensing board.
CHAN - And, a final technical question, chair Joyce and Mayor Wu, the button licensed the board is appointed by whom?
JOYCE - The mayor.
CHAN - The mayor is your appointing authority. What's your term of office?
JOYCE - Six years.
CHAN - Six years is your term of office and is indefinite or is it term limited? Is it go can you be for.
JOYCE - I think it's been happening, but I'm only I'm halfway through my first full term.
CHAN - Alright. That's always good to hear from finish your job. Thank you very much for that your SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any other questions from members of the committee, Representative Howard.
HOWITT - Thank you, Mr. Chair. Although this is, sort of, outside the realm of this particular hearing. I'm just curious as we have gone to allowing cannabis to be legal in Massachusetts, how was it determined your cannabis licenses, were they done by ZIP code as you're asking for this, or how were they, presented and, allowed to be opened.
WU - Chair Joyce, would you5062 like to start on that 1? The process for cannabis5064 licenses?
JOYCE - Sure. So I'm also, chair of the Boston Cannabis Board and the number of cannabis licenses in the city of Boston is tied to the number of package store licenses in the city of Austin. We have a minimum number of licenses, which I believe is 53 that we need to meet. And we, issue those licenses, following a one to one equity ratio. one equity applicant is heard before one non equity applicant. And we hold public hearings monthly, and we have a seven member board. And after we approve a license, it goes up to the state for final issuance.
WU - So there's not a ZIP code process in place. There's almost, in some ways, the reverse of that where the waivers and, you're not you're not supposed to issue a license, within a certain radius of another 1, although that can be overridden with the vote of the board as well.
HOWITT - Thank you very much. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you, representative, Howard. Any other questions, Committee? Representative above.
LEBOEUF - I know you've had it long here. I so I'll keep this very brief. With the licenses for these licenses, are there restrictions in place for ownership in regards to how many license as an applicant can have. Right. So for example, like, if you, like, on this schedule, like, there's five issued, could someone potentially one owner get all five at the same time. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER2 - Adam share?
JOYCE - I guess, hypothetically, that could happen for on premise. If an applicant wanted to go into one of these, unrepresented neighborhoods and ring his or her concept there. And we thought there was a public need for this particular concept in this neighborhood. I might it's a guess. I guess we would have to look at the business plan and see if the public need was met at that time, but there is no restriction on the number of as it's written right now on the number of licenses in particular, individual can have. Again, we look at this through the lens of public need what the need is of the community. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you, Ms. Lavaf. Any other questions from members committee? Hearing none, you are finally done, Madamir. Thank you very much for your patience.
SPEAKER2 - Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - Alright. We're going to take state legislators, out of turn next. We have Senator Edwards and Senator Miranda coming up together. So and I understand you might be bringing a guest, Senator Edwards and Senator Miranda.
Black Economic Council of Massachusetts - Good afternoon. I am Senator Liz Miranda, joined by Nicole Obi of the Black Economic Council of Massachusetts and also by my sister in service, Senator Lydia Edwards. I'll have Nicole go first, chairman, if that's okay with you, and Senator Edwards, and I'll close out our panel.
NICOLE OBI - BLACK ECONOMIC COUNCIL OF MASSACHUSETTS - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon. Thank you to chairman Cronin and chairman Chan My name is Nicole Obi. I'm the president's CEO of Black Economic Council of Mass. I’m, I'm here before you today on behalf of BECMA in strong support of house bill 3741 and senate bill 2380. An Act authorizing additional licenses for the sale of alcoholic beverages. BECMA is a minority and woman led non profit5274 supporting black led businesses all across the Commonwealth and within the city of Boston. BECMA was founded to address the racial and economic disparities that exist in black communities within the commonwealth. We were founded in response to the findings of the Boston Fed's College Wealth Study.
Which found that the average net worth of Black Boston Households was $8 compared to White Boston Household of a quarter of a $1,000,000. And BECMA's work is to address This and other disparities and is guided by our four principles around ownership, which is about getting capital to our entrepreneurs to launch and scale their businesses. Placement is about putting our members on boards and commissions and in the growth economy. Commerce is about helping with transactions, whether retail or procurement and ownership, which is about helping our businesses get a greater equity stake5338 in the firms that they're running and our homeowners to own homes and build wealth. So today, I'd like to highlight that this legislation supports three of our four pillars around entrepreneurship commerce and our ownership pillars.
House bill5354 3741 and Senate bill 2380 proposes the establishment of restricted non transferable liquor license is in these 10 ZIP codes. In the city of Boston, there's a disc, concerning pattern that has emerged where liquor licenses have been concentrated in predominantly white ZIP codes, while neighborhoods like Roxbury, Dorchester, Mattapan, and Hyde Park are have been excluded from opportunities for economic development that other parts of the cities have been experiencing. Sits. The overwhelming majority of purchases of transferable licenses over the past two years are outside of our targeted ZIP codes. This initiative is not merely about diversifying the hospitality industry. It represents a critical stride towards narrowing the alarming racial wealth gaps that continue to plague Boston's Black communities.
Sit down restaurants are not just places to dine. They are the lifeblood of thriving neighborhoods. They serve as engines of economic development, generators of, employment opportunities and essential hubs for community engagement. This bill offers a unique and indispensable opportunity to enhance our city's cultural vibrancy simulate economic growth and foster long overdue equity in conclusion, BECMA stamped firmly in support of these bills. We urged this committee to recognize the urgency and the immense value of this legislation, not only for Boston's hospitality industry, but also for the overarching goals of community economic development and racial equity. Thank you for your time, and we look forward to working together to create a bright more equitable future for all the residents5458 of Massachusetts. Thank you.
SEN EDWARDS - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon, members of the committee to the chairs. Thank you very much for taking me out of turn. My name is Lydia Edwards. I'm a senator representing the 3rd Suffolk of Boston. And for those who, may not be intimately familiar with all of the, neighborhoods that I represent. I do this little. Hope you find it entertaining. Anyway, so the way I describe my district is one way. We're separated by a harbor. I have East Boston, Winthrop, Olive in Winthrop, and Olive in Revere are one side. And on the other side of that harbor, I have shaped like a fist, the fist of Boston and the wrist of Boston, which is all of downtown and Back Bay. No one laughed. Alright. Fine. I tried. I I'm trying to bring some levity and some little bit relaxation5507 to this conversation, while tense, it is it's important because it matters so deeply to all of us.
What I will have to say is I I sit in a unique5515 position as being one of legislators and maybe one of the few people in this room that have actually been a city councilor for Boston, and now a state legislator for Boston. I've seen this issue from both sides. I've had to be the one write those letters, as you mentioned Chair Chan about supporting, local licenses or not supporting them. I've had to be the one where people come to complaining about the lab noise, the alcohol, the, the police concerns, the vomiting. I've been at that very moment. We're counselors are. And now I'm in this unique position, right, to work with my colleagues statewide as I have learned continually being a state being a person of this body, being a member of this general court, that all of the issues that we deal with, all of the issues that we deal with are bigger than Boston.
Our traffic issues we are connected on. We are connected on our environmental issues, our waterway issues, and yet on our economic development and racial justice issues as well. So if we're going to talk bigger than Boston, and if you're going to be part of that conversation, for bigger than Boston. As you already are, I am asking you to then be part of helping to solve some of those issues as well. When it comes to the racial disparity, when it comes to these liquor licenses, that is an issue that is bigger than Boston, because it involves your hands as well. I know you've heard the statistics. I know you heard about the disparities that in certain ZIP codes and certain white neighborhoods, it is one to 70 patrons per license, whereas in other neighborhoods in Boston, it's one to 3300 per licensed patrons.
We are dealing with a disparity. That is racially based. We are dealing with a system that has a lot to do with stereotypes, not necessarily racial, but ethnic, dealing with our Irish constituents. We are dealing with legacy that this system has created. It is not perfect. As you know, and many of you who have been here longer than me, have been helping to try and work this system out. So this is one tool in the toolbox. We're5634 asking you to take very seriously because we have a problem. We cannot wait. And the third Suffolk, as I mentioned before, I represent two distinct worlds, all of downtown Boston. I see what liquor licenses, entertainment, what it does for tourism, what it does for local jobs every single day as do you when you come to the state house which is in my district. I also see the difference, and I saw it as a city councilor during COVID.
When a lot of my small business owned by immigrants, first time generation individuals, people of5666 color of all backgrounds, barely5668 survived. They did not have a liquor license. They couldn't take advantage of any take home licensure. They barely made it. And I was part of the team of individuals trying to come up with economic grants to help keep our businesses alive, to help keep people housed. You were there too, because it was bigger than Boston. We were nimble together. We were smarter together. And so I'm asking you to be part of this conversation together. This system has set us up in a way, but we're dealing within housing as well. As you know, chair of housing, the scarcity has made it so much more expensive. We do need more liquor licenses. Period. I don't know that you're debating that.
The system that dispenses them is what I heard is a5715 concern to you. I'm asking you to trust the individuals the day to day people who are dealing with those phone calls, those city councilors who you will hear from, those state representatives who are your colleagues. Your colleagues who are senators, we need those licenses and we need a system that makes sure that is equitable. I am asking that you to create that. If it is bigger than Boston and your concerns are truly, and I know they are valid and come from a good place, then you need to be part of helping us to get there. In closing, I would just want to note that, state representative, Howitt You brought up, cannabis. When we were coming up and I was helping to write the licensing for cannabis. When we were coming up with that system, we looked to this system of liquor licenses and sought for what a mess that it was.
We said we can't continue this in this point. We actually made sure the licenses didn't cost anything. We made sure that you had to apply for, speak to, to your5782 moral character, where you're going to be, how you're going to impact schools, all of these different things, and we kept5786 it at a very local level. We had community input. We, of course, had the counselors, and we had that system set up in a place with distances to make sure that we didn't replicate what we have right now. So we've learned is what I'm trying to say. And I know that your biggest concern is how we learned from the past, have we seen a difference absolutely when given the opportunity with cannabis, we did. We are. And so I'm asking you again for that opportunity to my colleagues in the statehouse. Believe in Boston, We know5814 it's bigger than us, and I'm asking it for5816 your help. Thank you.
SEN MIRANDA - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you to both Nicole and to Senator Edwards. I before I begin my quick remarks, I want to just also shout out, the mayor of Boston and my colleagues, there are so many colleagues who are here and online, even those that represent neighborhoods that have many, many licenses because the people that know what Bob the needs of in this room today. I also want to take a moment to shout out, the owners of Estella Grace By Nia, Daryl's District seven Wally's Meta. The Pearl who are all behind me, which represent over 70% of actually the black owned businesses that we have that have a liquor license. I think there are four people missing from that list. And the last thing I'd like to say before my remarks is as the chair of racial equity and as a house member for four years and now a senator. And before I even5870 got these great, honorable, titles, I know that we cannot wait to address the racial wealth gap.
We don't have another generation. We don't have another year. We don't have another term. Because it's actually worsened in this blue liberal state that we like5887 to call Massachusetts. And for black and brown people, to who are here in this building, as members of the Black and Latino Caucus. And then, representative Worrell who filed this with me we are one of only 24 in the entire body. And so we understand the urgency, the matters because this might look like just the liquid license bill but really it's a racial equity and justice bill. So I want to thank you all, for giving us the time today, calling us out of turn I'm here to represent the 2nd Suffolk, the home of Black Boston, but really the home of Black Massachusetts as it is the black district in the Commonwealth. Whether it's on Mass Ave in the south end, or whether it's in Lower Roxbury or down Blue Hill Avenue, rock sparing to Grove Hall.
And then into Mattapan. Or whether it's Egleston Square and all the other neighborhoods in my district, they were once the cultural hubs of the city of Boston had unique restaurants nightlife and a strong sense of community. In the last three decades, we've actually seen a massive loss of those businesses that played an integral role in our communities. Cause these small businesses are the backbone of our cities. It's where we build community in our families and where we come together. These liquor licenses follow a pattern of removal from Boston's neighborhoods of color. While being concentrated in Boston's widest neighborhoods. Out of the 1400 plus, and we've heard today, even 2000 licenses, beyond liquor licenses in the city of Boston. Only 2% are held by black owned businesses in a city that is nearly 25% black and over 50% of color. The secondary market,5988 which we've heard a lot about today.
Without needed reform, of sit down restaurants and bar liquor licenses in the city of Boston has actually perpetuated this growing racial wealth gap. The secondary liquor license market, which we know has needs reform, has created an ecosystem in our city where only affluent property and restaurant owners can afford the cost of operating. Currently, in the 2nd Suffolk district, I represent a third of the city of Boston. If anyone here has visited my district, you'd be able to visit all of the sit down restaurants in under a week. That have liquor licenses. As I was campaigning for this seat, I recall making it a point to host events. At many black owned restaurants and businesses that I could. And we were so intentional about that with our resources and our time. But only after a couple of months, we ran out of places to support. There is an abundance of culinary talent in our communities and across the city of Boston.
But when licenses in the secondary market are selling for 500,000, 600,000, and even as high as 700,000 while those are only the licenses available, we are perpetuating an exclusionary system that is pushing away first time operators, small business owners, immigrant women, and people of color. Restaurant Tourism in my district have born the brunt of not only the lackluster pandemic error policies and resources, but also investment from the city and state in securing a successful future. The simple truth is that restaurants cannot survive without the ability to serve liquor. If S.2380 is passed, it would be an enormous opportunity for more restaurants nightlife and cultural districts and hubs to actually thrive in our community. We must be intentional when we discuss the closure of the economic and racial wealth gap that is prevalent in the state of Massachusetts but it's most notably prevalent in communities in my district.
Roxbury, Dorchester, Mattapan, High Park, to name a few. It's not only about making money, but it's also about keeping money in your districts. There isn't a day that goes by where our office doesn't hear from prospective entrepreneurs. Who wants to open small businesses in the communities that they love, they live, and they grew up in. Or maintain a small business, in our community.6137 This is about creating opportunities6139 where barriers actually already exist. We don't want to just survive living in the city of Boston, we want to thrive. And we know the top two ways to do that and end the racial wealth gap disparities is to, 1, be able to buy a home, the chair of housings right here, how difficult it is to buy a home in the city of Boston. But the other is to approve, not achieve, sorry, the American dream about owning a small business in your community. I want to thank all the small business owners who came out today the electors that you hear from throughout the day.
The advocates in the community that have come out to champion this6176 issue. They know that this is not solely about their business. But the thousands of businesses that are either unopened and unopened or lacking the resources to actually thrive in their communities. I want to thank you, Mr. chairman and chairman Cronin, and the members of this6192 committee to speak to you today. Sadly, I am, a hour6196 a half away. Hour and a half late to a very important meeting along, with the CEO of BECMA. We have to leave, but I want you all to know that that is not an indication of my team's willingness and my willingness to answer each and every question that we have post this hearing. I know it's gone a little bit longer. Than I expected, and I should have prepared better. But I have this meeting that I have to go to. So I want to say thank you, to of you. And I've heard from, Senator Edwards that she also will remain a little longer, if you have questions to answer on our behalf. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Oh, thank you for the testimony. And, oh, you never know how this is going to go when the day starts. I'd like to put it to everybody. Does, anybody have any questions for the people testifying? Seeing none, thank you very much for your time.
SPEAKER14 - Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - I'd like to call up representative whirl from the committee to testify.
REP WORRELL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon. Chair, Shane Chan, and chair Cronin, and the team members of this committee. I'm here to testify in support of Bill H.3741 and act on additional liquor license, beverages to be dunked on premises in Boston. Before I get into the testimony, I do want to recognize, there are some store owners here6307 that had to leave due to the6309 fact that they're the only ones that are their business today. So they took time to come out, but then I got a couple texts saying they had to go because they're the only ones running their business. And some stayed like in my, a young man named, Mark Reid, who owns Humminbird,6328 who decided to stay here, because this is how important it is for him, a two-person operation to be here on the importance of having the ability to have liquor license in his establishment.
Firstly, I want to thank the group of Bostonians, entrepreneurs, restauranteurs, and community members, and elected officials for believing in our vision for a better Boston. At the surface, this bill is about liquor license, but in the essence, it's about so much more. As a state representative of the 5th Suffolk district is my primary objective to bring resources to my community. An6372 addition five liquor license and 10 ZIP codes every6376 year for five years is not an additional 250 liquor license. It's an additional 250 opportunities for entrepreneurs, tourism, and economic development for the city Boston, having growing up and living in two of the ZIP codes, including in this legislation, I can tell you firsthand that there is a demand in the city for sit down dining, entertainment options outside of downtown, and you will hear that message echoed by the testifiers here today.
The economic and cultural diversity of Boston is what makes this unique compared to any other city in town and the commonwealth. Boston has 38 ZIP codes, each different in their own beautiful way, but some more traveled than others. I believe that this is the best opportunity we have as legislative body to invest in the neighborhoods who have been eagerly awaiting chance to strive. As a representative of one of the blackest and brownest and brightest districts in the state of Massachusetts, one of the things I hear most from my community is that government doesn't care about them. Less than 2% of current liquor license owners are Boston self identified as black. If passed, the spill would change the narrative and would be a clear, direct investment in developing these communities. Restaurants are essential for building communities and6477 economic engines to success. They are also nearly impossible to open and keep afloat6483 without liquor license.
In fact, 80% of the restaurant's concepts are not profitable without alcohol sales. This bill will not only generate development and the building generational wealth for small businesses, owners, but keep the wealth in these ZIP codes given nontransferable nature of the license. We in the city of Boston are thriving to welcome the arrival of mom and pop restaurants as well as branded eateries. The introduction of these esteemed restaurant groups represent a significant milestone for our community. These branded eateries are not only unique culinary experience, but also symbolize the increase of investments of development and our district. This development aligns with our vision for a thriving vibrant community, providing our residents with diverse dining options, and most importantly, creating job opportunities. I believe that where you live shouldn't stop you from achieving your dreams.
These liquor license will give these anxious entrepreneurs the opportunity to create something for themselves. There and our community. And like Senator Miranda said earlier, when I was, running for this seat, I was looking around for places where I could have a fundraiser, and there was only one place in my entire district I can have that fundraiser at with a alcohol, preference, and that's the same place I continue to go. And there's so much more, vibrant places within my community that are eagerly waiting like Hummingbird, who's still here, Marguerite, like, like Astellas, the owner from Astellas who's, born and raised in my district, but has to go downtown to open up a business with a liquor license. So my dream is to provide resources for my community, and this bill would do exactly that. I'm asking you to pass H.3741 favorably out of committee, and thank you very much. Any questions? SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Good thing we are bringing on the committee. We can find you anytime one representative of the world. With questions isn't a problem. But, no, we appreciate advocacy you have for your district and this legislation representative of the world. Been working with the committee, chairs, as well as the individual members, as well as the Boston Neglegation, your vivid and vibrant conversation on this matter. We do thank thank you for that. And I do want to let your constituents know that you're working very hard for them as chair of the committee as well as chair Cronin. So with that, we'll not ask you questions because we do know how to find you represent help? Thank you. Reps in Mun Montani, reps in Montayo. Did I get that correct? Oh, mine as well. two for 1.
SPEAKER15 - I'd like to go first. Yeah.
SPEAKER18 - You can go first.
REP MONTAÑO - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you, chair for having us. Chairs for having us, members of the committee. My name6675 is Representative Sam Montano, and I'm here to testify, on behalf6679 of my district. I represent the 15th Suffolk which includes Jamaica Plan in back of the hill. Our ZIP code was admitted from the original, home roll petition, but I've spoken with the filers, both at the city council level and at the state house level. And they are, very okay with us making an amendment to include 02130 in this bill as well. Jamaica Plain has lost several liquor licenses over the last couple of years to the sea ports. We have five neighborhood licenses currently in our district. one of the folks who has, a license is actually here to testify.
So we're here, to speak to the amendment to be added to the to the home rule and to also encourage folks to allow Boston to disseminate these liquor licenses across the board. We consistently hear from folks that Boston is an unaffordable city that it's not it's not a late night city. It's not a fun city. We lose young to other cities that are more affordable and have more options, like, like, when I think of Chicago or Philadelphia, they have a plethora of restaurants that are small spaces and able to cater to the different culinary cultures in in the cities, and they thrive. I think something else that's missing that we would like to see on the ground is the ability of restaurants to be not just on the main strip, but in other parts of the community as well. And so in addition to being able to hold more folks in the district to create more affordability for folks who are looking to get liquor licenses in order to encourage folks.
To stay in to buy in Boston to contribute to that tax bay tax base so that we can afford to do more services across the board. We need to be able to flood market with these neighborhood licenses so that business owners are able to thrive and we have a more diversity, of business owners on the ground. We know that because of systemic racism. That's just not happening. And as we lose and even folks who are able to get the liquor license on the market, they're pulling from funders and from investors who already have the capital by which to make this happen or have those connections, this would allow for more small business owners without those political connections, without those capital investments to thrive in our communities as well. So to strap it up, we really want the amendment, to that 02130 into the bill. Thanks.
REP MACGREGOR - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Let's get this all in mind here. Good afternoon, Shane. Chair Cronin and honorable6828 members of the committee. Thank you for taking me out6830 of turn as well. So my name is Bob MacGregor. And I am the, state rep for the 10th Suffolk District that was actually just elected in, June. So I haven't met all of you, but looking forward to working with everyone. And my district covers majority of West Rock Spray, parts of Rosendale, parts of Jamaica, and Brooklyn as well. And I'm here to speak today in support of house bill 3741 and send a bill 2380.
If passed, these two bills will be a significant step towards supporting small business owners, especially owners of color across the city of Boston, by putting liquor licenses directly in the hands of our neighborhood local restaurants and bars, we're helping small businesses to not just succeed but thrive. These bills have been constructed careful community input at both the state and the municipal level, and they've been constructed in a way that reflects the desires and concerns of impacted communities. During my time working in city hall, it was frustrating seeing restaurant owners struggle to serve their customers because of the lack of available and affordable liquor licenses.
The pandemic not, only made those conditions worse. And now as business trends shift more shift and more people are staying near their homes rather than having downtown, it's important that we help our local restaurants meet new and meet new demand. As it stands, as, rep Montaño mentioned, the language of the bill includes ZIP codes 02132 and 02131. two ZIP codes that are in the 10th Suffolk district. As the state representative for three precincts within Jamaica plain, I would ask that zero 2130 is also included in the final language of this bill. House bill 3741 and senate bill 2380 will be incredibly beneficial for the 10th Suffolk District. For all these reasons and more, the bills have my full support, and I ask that the committee report them both out favorably. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thanks.
MONTAÑO - Just quickly6949 something else that I'd like to add. I forgot.6951 We have developers who are developing in our district are building commercial spaces because that's what's being encouraged by the city, but they are unable to fill those commercial spaces because they cannot find a tenant who can afford a liquor license on the market. So this neighborhood liquor license would allow for those commercial spaces that are already being built to not remain vacant and to be filled with a commercial space that would like to liquor licenses. So we know vacancy leads to increased rates of crime that, makes the neighborhood less walkable and is a is safety issue across the board. So by allowing us to fill these vacant commercial spaces with restaurants, we're increasing the safety, the public safety of the neighborhood, we're adding to the vitality and we're increasing, home values across the area. I hate I don't talk about home values a lot, but home values across the area. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you very much for your testimony. Appreciate your advocacy on the matter. Any questions from members committee? Hearing none, thank you very much for your time. This point, we go virtually to, I'm going to man I'm going to start mangling names now because of those who've seen it before, no, I don't do a good job with this. Representative, I'm sorry, a counselor, Julia Mahaire, counselor.
SPEAKER27 - Hey. Good afternoon. Not bad.
SPEAKER1 - I I try. You can't promise to go well. When your name's more phonetic, then, ethnic, it sounds a little different. Counselor, you have the floor. Okay.
SPEAKER27 - So here so it's Mejia. Want to try that?
SPEAKER1 - Representative, counselor here. Is that good?
SPEAKER17 - Good.
SPEAKER8 - That's right.
SPEAKER27 - Growth my No. You are doing. You're not trying. You're making it happen, and I appreciate the effort. Okay? So I'm happy to be with you all here today.
JULIA MEJIA - BOSTON CITY COUNCIL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon, and thank you to, the committee for allowing us to speak. I'm here. I'm city councilor at large. Representing the entire city of Boston all 23 neighborhoods. And I'm here to support my colleagues and their efforts to expand legal licenses across the city of Boston. I would just say as the chair of economic empowerment here in the city of Boston, and having worked, with small businesses during the COVID pandemic, I learned a lot about what we can do differently to support our small businesses. I know that we've been talking a lot about black owned businesses, and I think that's really important for us to uplift. And I also want to, bring into the space as the only citywide Latinx representation for the city of Boston wanted to just, bring this issue to the forefront.7101 And also speak upon some of the7103 Latino owned businesses, many of which are immigrant owns businesses here in the city of Boston.
I can think of a few in particular that have reached out to our office looking for additional supports. one is El Barrio, which is in Dorchester. They're looking to expand and secure a liquor license so that they can continue to grow their business, and have yet to be able to do that. And then another business in Jamaica Plains. So I'm happy, to support, reps, Montaño’s, need to also include Jamaica Plain. So, you know, ultimately, at the end of the day, I really love what Senator Miranda mentioned around being a racial equity issue that oftentimes we talk about meeting the moment. And when we have an opportunity to help support Black and Brown businesses, we failed to meet the mark. And so as a citywide Councilor, I'm here in, advocating7155 that we support this particular effort and also understand that this is not just around filling out licenses, but this is going to have a ripple effect on those that are the business owners who are going to be able to help support their our economy and also the nightlife.
You know, you've heard from my colleagues that the city of Boston does not have, many places in Dorchester, Roxbury, Mattapan, and East Boston, and other areas where they have high concentration of Black and Latinx people. So for me as a citywide counselor, I just wanted to go on the record in full support. I worked alongside Councior, Louijeune, and thank you for your, support in expanding that to the Bruce Golden Building and the Strand. So now it's time to take that work to another level. Look, I know you're probably overwhelmed by the number even if you give us half. I think that, it's really about helping us meet the moment. And I think We're at, at a crossroads in the city of Boston, and I really do believe that, it's time for us to, to stand up, and, and fight for the things that we've been advocating for. And I really do appreciate the other rep who's looking to give us back local control, because I think we should have the rights to decide for ourselves what we need. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you very much for your testimony. Any questions for the counselor? Hearing none, thank you very much for your time counselor. We also have counselor Gabriela Koletta. We're we're, okay. We're not available at the moment. We're going to move along here we got represent, Councilor Frank Baker. I just want to bring everybody up at once just for ease. Counster Council of Mark Flarity, counselor Aaron Murphy. Good to see you guys. Just for the sake of ease, I've been calling up at one time. Sharon Durgin? Is is is Council Durgin still here? Yeah. Just come on down. We do is that is that every Watson counselor in the room? Anybody? Alright. Well, let's let's avoid a quorum. We don't want to get into what the AG's public record skies. Okay? Open meeting law people. So, You guys can sort out who goes first.
SPEAKER28 - Yeah. Today.
FRANK BAKER - BOSTON CITY COUNCIL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - My name's Frank Baker. I'm the district three city council and, members of the committee also. Sorry. Uh-uh, and as a chief, as the person representing district three, someone's been strong advocate for additional liquor licenses in in Boston throughout my tenure. I was here in 14. I was involved in the original legislation. I also was a lead sponsor in a umbrella legislation that that brought licenses to, South Bay, also a form of small restaurant owner that had a Baron wine license in Dorchester on Dorchester Ave. I'm here to speak in support of Spill House 3741 and Senate7334 238o. An Act authorizing additional licenses for the sale of alcoholic beverages to be drunk on the premises in Boston.
If approved, this will be a great benefit to these communities by ensuring economic growth and stability in these areas. This bill before you will create restricted non non transferable licenses to 10 ZIP Codes in Boston covering the Southern out of the city and East Boston. This will prevent licenses from bringing bought or move to other neighborhoods like the down counter or the7366 Seaport and maintain licenses in the same ZIP code that that, that should they return to the city. I was a district council that probably benefited. I would say the most on the last on the last round. I was ready with the with the development coming into7384 my district, and I was able to direct people towards the licenses.7388 And we had a very, very robust community process to get them ready to go the licensing department and for the most part the places where people were looking to put the licenses.
Were places that people7403 were more than welcome to bring them in. And, again, I hear your concerns around, whether if they turn into nightclubs and things like that, we have all the same concerns. I don't think we should overlook the value in a communal gathering space that restaurants become having had my own restaurant. It literally had the same people coming in these neighborhoods. You have the same people coming in, and that sort of cheers effect. That's we want to apply across the entire city of Boston. And this will help us to do that. It will bring needed opportunities into neighborhoods that are, quite frankly, overlooked right now. The thought the talk around gentrification is real. I think we need to weigh talk of gentrification. Thank you, and thank you for my time.
ERIN MURPHY - BOSTON CITY COUNCIL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you. Thank you chair, Chan and Cronin, and board members, I'm Erin Murphy. I'm an at large city councilor. And I'm here to speak in support of house bill 3741 and senate bill 2380, which is on its face a pedestrian liquor license bill, but which I view as a matter of economic justice and redressing historic inequities in Boston Neighborhoods. By creating restricted nontransferable licenses for 10 ZIP codes in East Boston and the southern part of the city, this legislation would bring a small measure of balance to the long lopsided distribution of liquor licenses across the city. By preventing licenses from being bought or shifted to higher rent districts like downtown or the South Boston Waterfront.
In maintaining these licenses in the same ZIP code in the event7513 that the licenses are returned to the city, this bill would ensure the small effort at balance is preserved moving forward. Ultimately, this is a matter of fairness. Liquor licenses are crucial to the survival of sit down rest in my home of Dorchester sorely need the economic injection that sit down restaurants not to mention their community element places for folks to gather, meet their neighbors, and show off to visitors. These restaurants mean jobs and neighborhoods that crying out for additional economic opportunity. There's no use of taxpayer dollars. There's no ask beyond simply bringing a measure of balance and fairness to a market that has for far too long been out of balance and lacking fairness. Historically, these neighborhoods have been underserved by an Allan system.
Only 10 of the city's 1342 liquor licenses are in Mattapan, embellic of the lack of parody across the city. It's high time we fix that, and this bill represents an excellent step in that direction. I want to commend my colleague, Councilo Brien Worrell, state representative Chris Worrell, and thank you for your testimony and always advocating for your dear district, and state senator Liz Miranda for undertaking this effort Boston is a great city, but we are still a city that needs to tackle historic inequities. As an at large city councilor, it is job to represent every neighborhood. And I believe this bill would be a win for all of my constituents, and I strongly urge you for a passage. Thank you. And before I pass it off to Councilor Flaherty, I do just want to, say, I appreciate the questions that you were asking the, the former really made me think about making sure that we get this right. So thank you for your thoughtfulness in this process. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - You have to push the button. I'm sorry. The yeah. You gotta the yeah. Turn it. Yeah. There we go.
SHARON DURKAN - BOSTON CITY COUNCIL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you. And thank you to my colleagues for being here. I7646 want to thank the committee chairs, John Cronin and Tackey Chan for hearing us out today. All of our Boston delegation, grateful to Rep Worrell, I'm grateful to, city Councilor Worrell in the mayor for being here, as well as my state senator, Lydia Edwards, and, state senator Liz Miranda who represents Mission Hill, part of my district. I’m Sharon Durkan, the newly elected Boston City Council for District Eight, which includes West End, Beacon Hill, Back Bay, the Fenway, and Mission Hill. So why is the District Eight councilor here someone who has a lot of liquor licenses in my district?
And it's because the president supply of liquor license and their concentration in the downtown neighborhoods constrains the economic growth of all of Boston and, we know that, it's an equity issue. For example, we know that Mattapan only has 10 total liquor licenses. As the District Eight counselor, my district may not touch these specific ZIP codes, but to my district is home to two major entertainment district. Which outline year after year the health of Boston's nightlife and Boston scene is of utmost importance. And, to our healthy, business scene. Folks in all of our neighborhoods should be able to grab an after work drink enjoy birthday party, a graduation, or just simply enjoy a cocktail, with a meal in their neighborhood. Not only will this change allow for economic growth but it'll foster growth in our communities as well.
I'm a fan of local hunts in my district, the sevens, the squealing pig, and corn walls, every single neighborhood should have one of those places, in there. And so, seeing popular spots and growing businesses in Dorchester, Mattapan, Roxbury, and Hyde Park will boost those neighborhood profiles and encourage growth throughout our city. I want to thank all of my council colleagues for being here. I want to thank Councilor Baker, Councilor Flaherty Councilor Murphy, Councilors Majia, and Coletta, for testifying. And we know we cannot we can't neglect other neighborhoods in Boston. Our, our city and neighborhood scene, we need every single neighborhood to be vibrant. And we're in a unique position right now to place a real emphasis on revitalizing our business ecosystem, post the COVID 19 pandemic A lot of our businesses are bouncing back.
And this would be of great importance7797 to our city to have access to this.7799 And we have a special opportunity to make a real impact, in granting these additional licenses, the state would not only be playing a crucial role to address long standing business disparities across our neighborhoods, but prove7812 to be a vital partner with the city and7814 realizing this urgent opportunity to support the success of businesses and7818 the communities our business create in neighborhoods and ZIP in in the neighborhoods and ZIP codes outlined in this filing, supporting the business economies of every neighborhood help the Boston economy as a whole, we should be jump this should only be a jumping off point. There's still more work to do in liquor license reform. But I applaud everyone who's been working on this. And I urge, the committee to offer favorable report on this matter. And I thank you for your time and consideration.
MICHAEL FLAHERTY - BOSTON CITY COUNCIL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you, Chair Chan and Chair Cronin, and to the members of the committee, and special shout out to my a different and former fellow eagle, Senator Timothy, we went to BC together as Glasgow. So always great to see him and have great memories, here in this building, playing hide and go seek with my brother and sisters. My father served in legislature from 1965 to 1990, distinguishing himself, both, for his Christmas parties, and as chair of judiciary. So, always good to be back, at the state house. Here, obviously, to support, this initiative, liquor license is not7885 critical to the success, for sit down restaurants, without a licensed businesses, are limited to counter service7891 and takeout as well as competing with restaurants that do have, liquor licenses.
And there are several pockets of our city, and I speak as the longest serving. I've seen many iterations of this as the longest serving member of the Boston City Council, and addressed a number of the different issues restricting them here, separate category for hotels, something for the airport, all never really got off the ground and never get to fruition for passage. So, this year is the latest iteration whereby we're recognizing, a need to, close a gap. We do have food deserts, here in the city. You wouldn't think of us if you're down the South Boston Waterfront, or in the downtown back bay area, but, we do have a need for investment, in some of our neighborhoods, and this would go a long way in creating7936 gathering spaces where folks can sit and dine and meet their neighbors7940 and attract, visitors and tourists to their neighborhood. So house bill for 3741 and senate bill 2380 will create restricted non transferable license to 10 ZIP codes.
Particularly in the southern part of the city, as well as in East Boston, prevent licenses from being bought or move to7959 other neighborhoods, which we tried to prevent years ago and maintain licenses in the same ZIP code. The challenge for this committee will be to strike that balance, as representative I had alluded to, cities and towns having to come here hat in hand, with that and, as well as the push for in equity was swinging for the fences. The ask of 200 it's a big ask. Somewhat argue might be excessive, but it it's a big ask. And the, the, the, the time and talent of this committee will be there to guide, that process. We were concerned about several things. We were considered we're concerned about devaluing existing, transferable licenses, many of which are, they are tangible assets. To Chair Chan, add on your list of questions, if any banks, because people get to use them collateral.8010
People can use them to lend on to borrow on, to make repairs, to expand their business. So and in some instances, educate their children, and they sometimes get tied up in probate court. As an attorney, I see that, husband, wife, part, or siblings are fighting over, an establishment or license that has been left and so that might be another question as to whether or not any of them are tied up, in probate. The city has to be judicious in where they place them. You can't that you have a you're going to have a great burger joint that has a transferable license that they pay through the nose at. 600,000 is a is a is a big high body entry to get a restaurant going to get a full liquor license, 600,000. You have a restaurant that has, transferable license. And then the city gives, a freebie to someone right next door across the street kind of puts them in in a competitive disadvantage where their menu items can be $5, $7, $10 cheaper.
So we need to be judicious on our end and make no mistake about it when you serve alcohol. There are some inherent dangers, with that. It's not all fun and games, could be an over serving situation, tremendous liability. Licenses have all also been used to serve as pledges and or to satisfy judgments, as well as liability, making sure that if we are giving, a free, nontransferable license that that the appropriate safeguards, the appropriate amount and level of insurance is there that currently exists for transferable. So, again, these are things that, your, August body and committee will have to sort of iron up, but there's no doubt about it. There's an imbalance, with respect to, liquor licenses in the city, Boston. We have an obligation to close the gap, keeping an eye on equity, but these are real concerns, many of which were brought out, in the initial testimony here.
And my hope is that you will find that right number, to give the city so we could, you know, resolve the food desert issue and also give people an opportunity, at really,8129 earning a good living providing great wages and benefits to their employees and that spin off. We see in a lot of our neighborhoods in city, a lot of the spin off is the result of you know, a good restaurant or a good shop and other restaurants, coffee shops, etcetera, spout up around them. So, there could be a good win win So that's it. Anyone has any specific questions given that I have, the longest period of time with this issue, but, nonetheless, I do support my colleagues that are promoting this, the time has strike the balance to close the gap. And then your wisdom, hopefully, you'll find, that right number for Boston to disperse appropriately, throughout the specific districts requested and to solve the food Desert districts. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you, counselor, clarity. Great job summarizing the committee, Paul, see on this regarding review. We really appreciate that. Thank you
SPEAKER32 - very much.
SPEAKER31 - That was an experience, Mr. Chien.
SPEAKER1 - Also want to, congratulate and thank you service on the count as well as counselor Baker for for many years. The guys from Quincy do watch what happens over the bridge, the southeast Dorchester people know what I'm talking about Yep. As I like to put it. But, no, it's it's, thank you for your testimony, and, you know, thank you for your service. Any questions for the members of the testifying panel representative I'm sorry, Senator Timothy.
Thank you, Ri We're well, Rarrell. You're always a great partner. No one else services. First of all,
SEN TIMILTY - Thank you, Chair Cronin, and8212 Chair Chan, to Council of Durkan. Congratulations. Look forward to working with you. Of course, Councilor Murphy. We see you an awful lot. You're an incredible advocate for your district and look forward to working with you on this bill in conjunction with my colleague to my left. And, of course, Senator Miranda and to, of course, Councilor Flaherty and Councilor of Baker. Congratulations to you both. Come January, you both will be missed. Both are hardworking honest individuals, and I'm lucky to8237 call you both friends. So thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Any other questions? You're being done? Mr. Cheah. Just one
FLAHERTY - Just one further comment, Mr. Chair Very much like taxi medallions. You should be viewing this with similar lens. Tax even down is at one point, was, you know, was a real, viable asset. You couldn't give them away today. Right? You can't give them away today because of Uber and Lyft, again, striking that balance to make sure we're not completely devaluing license that are out there that people had to borrow, beg, pay for work, hard hours for good, decent, hardworking8271 people who also recognize that8273 there's opportunity for more just don't want to see their sort of commodity completely devalued. And I like to reference taxing medallions because8280 it's probably the closest thing that I can see to, how if we flood the market, how we could have a very similar situation happen.
CHAN - For education, the younger members, before we had ride share, tax medallions were running about $250 to $300,000 peace in the city of Boston. In smaller communities, they're running about $10 depending where you are. In rural communities, you could almost never give one away because the geographic size, would became economically impractical. So Councilor Flaherty, I'm not probably been around as long as you, but I've been around the block a couple of times too. So for the case of the younger members, that's what the Councilor is pointing to, between the quarter, me, and the 20,000. And I was also reminded that the deposit convention center was funded on tax deductions through a surcharge. Right. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER31 - You couldn't do that today.
SPEAKER1 - You couldn't do that today. So, yeah, the evaluation is a legit issue. So, thank you for that. Any, Council World, a Representative World. Sorry about that.
SPEAKER24 - You got me, man. Mistaken.
WORRELL - Just want to thank you guys, again, to echo what, my center of the colleagues said, thank you for your education. On this bill. Thank you, Councilor Baker for being a strong Dorchester advocate. Being from Dorchester myself. Thank you for all the, the years you've been serving in that seat. Thank you, Councilor Flaherty. For your being so vocal on this. And thank you. Murphy, and thank you, Councilor Durkan. I was going to call you guys representatives. That's why I got stuck in my head. But thank you. Thank you guys so much. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER31 - Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - Thank you for your time. Alright. We're down. We we are done with the elected officials who probably are very happy about at this point, we're going to take work. Yeah. Alright. We entered a time. As you saw at the counters, they were able to stay within as close as possible to three minute testifying. Obviously, he would share his discretion. We're going to take John Fitzgerald in person.
JOHN FITZGERALD - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you very much, Jim and Chan, members of the committee. My name is John Fitzgerald. I'm situate from Dorchester, Massachusetts and a candidate for city council, District Three, coming up November 7th in case anyone is here hasn't registered to vote. Thank you. I'm here today. You you've heard a lot about the data today and a lot about the reason why and the nitty gritty of these licenses. And I think that you all appreciate that that information. So I'll here to speak upon very briefly, the philosophy behind this. Right? And that's the access to opportunity. And the access to opportunity, I feel, is needed because there are some there are some folks out there. There are some winners that we have yet to take a chance on.
And I shudder at the thought of the opportunities missed throughout time, throughout history, and most recently, of what we've missed out on in terms of8473 advancements, whether it be athletics, science, exploration, recovery, o always be only because folks did not have access to the opportunity to be great. And I think that's what this bill does here is that it allows for folks to have that access. I'm a strong believer that, you know, the hard work and smart planning will separate, the weed from the chaff here, but the access cannot be denied. And I think that's what this bill does. So out of respect for time for others, I'll leave it at that. But I appreciate the opportunity to comment, and I appreciate my friend, Representative Worrell, to be up here and put forth this bill. So thank you very much.
CHAN - Thank you, Mr. John Just a quick question. You, personally have no financial or personal interest in this bill. Correct?
FITZGERALD - No. I, I do not own any restaurants, or I drank. But,
CHAN - That is a degree of honesty.
FITZGERALD - And even then, I question that decision sometimes.
CHAN - We appreciate honesty immensely, but you don't have to get that honest. No. Thank you very much, Mr. Fitzgerald.
FITZGERALD - Thank you very much. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - We're going to take a Nick Korn and Leslie Hawkins from, well, Nick Nick Collins and Leslie Hawkins, what I have here at the moment. Come on down. three minutes a piece.
HAWKINS - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you, chair Chan, chair Cronin. Members of the committee, Lesley8560 Delaney Hawkins, with the law firm of Prince Lobel. I am here with Nick Corn as well as my colleague, Steve Miller. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Oh, you dragged along Steve. Cool. He he was essentially my mentor, so it's more he drags me along.
HAWKINS - You've already heard from me. I will be very brief, as someone who has been, as I mentioned on both the regulatory side and now back in private practice. I completely understand. I wouldn't be sitting here if I thought this bill had8583 the potential to negatively impact those who've invested in four value transferable licenses. I do not believe that that is the case here. We have only seen the, the value of these licenses increase over the years, even with separate legislation creating new restricted licenses, I represent large restaurant groups. I represent small individuals in East Boston who, in the case of the large restaurant groups, oftentimes they want to be looking at these neighborhoods that are currently underserved8611 in bringing in jobs with the smaller business owners. They want to get over this barrier to entry in the market.
Because, obviously, $600,000 is simply not accessible for the vast majority of individuals. And I truly feel that this bill through working with the counselors, with8628 the representative of Worrell, with the mayor's office, and continuing this to discussion, I think that this is narrowly tailored enough that it's not going to have a negative impact, and it really does achieve that important balance of ensuring equity and access to these licenses in these neighborhoods and two individuals of color, as well as protecting the interests of those who have invested hundreds of thousands dollars and pledge these licenses as collateral. So greatly appreciate your time, your very insightful questions, and obviously, we're all here to answer any and to continue moving the discussion forward. Thank you.
STEPHEN MILLER - MCDERMOTT, QUILTY & MILLER LLP - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Chair Chan, Chair Cronin, esteem members of the committee. Thank you for, devoting this much time to this this, important measure. My name is Steve Miller. I'm the managing pot of8681 McDermott, Quilty & Miller. And, I have a little different perspective to bring in front of you, not only have I been practicing law for decades in this area, but I'm also have been a, multiple owner of licenses, and I currently still own a license, right in the Fenway Hall area. I've also, now a lifetime member of the, Mass Restaurant Association, Board of Directors I have been the chair of the, mass continuing legal education seminar on alcohol licensing since 2006. It's long, Paul. It's all about longevity. You know, I wish I was so talented, but it's just when you stick around long and SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Steve, Steve, I think I've stuck around it as long as you have at this point, maybe even longer.
MILLER - But I just to get to the point I was here in 2006, 2014, there was no diminution in value of the licenses. I don't see it even happening here, at8751 any way, at any chance, but it's about accessibility It's about, cultural advancement,8757 and it's about economic8759 development. And, I'm also, speaking on behalf of the Wine and Spirits wholesalers, where I've been their legislative council for the past 40 years. To add one more, TAT, and the four biggest wholesalers in the state. Wine and spirits wholesale is see this as a great advancement for these areas. It's not something about their bottom line. It's really, allowing smaller mom and pop restaurants, the access to open8794 restaurants and compete and help these neighborhoods. So I'm not going to go on very long. I'd just like to thank, Representative Worrell, and obviously, your brother for all work that8808 you put into this. And I can't on behalf of all my hats, I overwhelmingly support this bill. Thank you.
NICK CORIN - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you to the joint committee and to the chairs for having me today. My name's Nick Corin. I live in 02121 in Roxbury, which is one of the ZIP codes that's targeted in this8829 bill. We have three on premise liquor licenses in my ZIP code despite having nearly 30,000 residents. I grew up working in restaurants in Boston, and I've watched for decades a system that favors well connected, well-funded corporations, while pushing a lot away aspiring small business owners people of color, women, queer folks, and immigrants. In other words, the8851 exact people that make restaurants great. I've spent the last two years collecting and8855 analyzing information on the liquor license system in Boston with the goal of providing legislators and policy makers like you with accurate information from which to make data driven decisions.
It's in this role that I come8866 before you today. Whenever a bill for additional licenses in Boston is proposed, the number one concern is that it will upset the careful balance of the secondary market erasing equity of existing transferable licenses holders. According to data, history, precedent, and expert testimony, the ZIP code restricted licenses in this bill will have no demonstrable impact on the secondary market of transferable licenses. So how do I know this? First, the bill will not increase supply in the secondary market. The bill as written explicitly forbids these ZIP code restricted licenses from being transferred to go back to the city. Moreover, the Boston licensing board, and you heard from chairman Joyce today, has made it very clear on multiple occasions they will not allow businesses with a transferable license to sell that license and apply for a restricted license in the same location.
Therefore, it will not increase supply. Second, this bill will not decrease demand on the secondary market in reviewing nearly 100 transfers from the last two and a half years, less than 7% were purchased by a business in one of these targeted ZIP codes. Put another way, more than 93% of potential buyers on the secondary market are completely unaffected by this legislation. Thirdly, the secondary market is not a free market, rather it's one that's highly regulated and for which the rules constantly change. For instance, in 2012, this committee passed a bill that created new airport restricted licenses, which had the consequence of8947 putting all 13 transferable is at Logan on the secondary market all at once. This flooding of supply, far from upsetting the careful balance of the market, had no demonstrable impact on8959 the price of transferable markets. Lastly, there's clearly a demand for these8963 restricted licenses.
And I hope we have time to hear from8965 some of the operators who would love to apply for them should this bill pass, and it does not cannibalize the secondary market. We interviewed dozens of restricted license holders, and more than 90% of them stated that if they had not received a restricted license from that 2016, or 2014 trench, that they would either not have opened or opened a different concept without a license. In closing, whereas transferable licenses are a zero sum game, subject to the hard cap set by chapter 138, restricted licenses, instead build a bigger table inviting folks who have historically been excluded from the current system, the very same people who make our restaurants great. I urge this committee to listen to the resounding support presented by Boston today and to recommend this bill favorably out. Thank you for your time and consideration, and I'm happy to answer any questions and even to address this taxi medallion comparison if you'll, if you'll give me the time. Yeah. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Why not? Get 30 seconds. Why not?
N CORIN - Thank you so much. Councilor Flaherty in the chair talked about9023 taxi medallions, right? So let's lean into that analogy for a second and imagine a time before ride shares, right? Also, for the purpose of this simulation, imagine that you can't call a taxi. The only way to get a taxi is hailing one on the street. Now imagine you live outside of downtown How long are you going to stand on a street corner waiting for a taxi to drive by? So this board could theoretically issue new medallions that were only allowed to pick up in those outlying neighborhoods that are historically underserved. So all of a sudden, people are not growing old waiting for a taxi to drive by, but we have dedicated taxi medallions just for the neighborhoods that have historically been overlooked by the system?
CHAN - No. That's not how that works, but we'll move on from there. Leslie, I got a quick question, because I got some clarity I understand. Who are you representing in all this? Because you're up with a mayor earlier, and now you got me confused.
HAWKINS - So I do not work for the city of Boston. I was called up just to help, at some questions. I'm with, the law firm of Prince Lobel. I'm in private practice.
CHAN - Alright. No. Thank you for that clarity because it you go on video. So you can see the optics issue where you'll come back and forth. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Re Representative Lab.
LEBOEUF - Oh, thank you. Just so first question, are any of you actually under contract with the city of Boston right now in regard this legislation lobbying for this legislation? No? Okay. Just No. Just want yeah. Just want to clarify. Just trying to clarify. Just
MILLER - I Steve and I are both practitioners in the field, which is why I think we were asked to lend, representing both people applying for restricted licenses and then representing people with unrestricted.
LEBOEUF - Okay. Do you currently have clients that are potential applicants for if new licenses were issued?
HAWKINS - Yes. Several. Okay.
LEBOEUF - So I guess my question, next question, I just Mr. Corin I just kind of want to understand the entity that you're representing get off-site. What is its particular role, within licensure? What was what's the particular you know, given that, you know, it sounds like it's more focused on an off-site. You know, it makes sense by the title. It would be focused on facilitating off-site licenses. And so what is the I guess, what's your role and what was the impetus behind this report?
N CORIN - Sure. Thank you so much for the question. I'm a bartender. I always will be a bartender and off-site develops training and development for people who work in and run restaurants all over the country. And so I believe in Boston is one of the best food and beverage destinations in the whole country, and I watched the structural imposition limit what is happening here and push first time operators out of this city. So why I'm here is because there's a ton of information that's, to be perfectly honest, hard to parse and find, and I realize that there's an opportunity for us to apply what we're good at, which is research and writing, to provide data so that our policy makers can make data driven decision making on this complicated issue?
LEBOEUF - Do you consult any applicants or serve as a representative for any applicants that potentially have a license pending before the licensing board?
N CORIN - No.
LEBOEUF - Okay. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Representative Howard.
HOWITT - Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just want, if I may get some clarification on these restricted licenses. So XYZ company comes in and says, okay, I'm going to apply for a license in one of these, ZIP codes. So I have the license. I'm in business for five years. My business doesn't pan out. I think I'm going to sell my business. Does the person who is buying the business automatically get the license transferred, or do they have to go back to the city to get the approval. So it's not part of the sale. It, it isn't included in the value of the business.
HAWKINS - Representative, that's one of the biggest questions. And it's one of the, the pieces9249 I think, and Steve, correct me if I'm9251 wrong, even people in the industry can be confused about? No. It is not part of the sale. It is nontransferable.9257 Even if you're at the same location, it reverts to the city, and your location doesn't give you a preference, other than being in the correct neighborhood. So if, I closed down and Steve is coming in to open, a restaurant at the same location. He gets in line just like anyone
HOWITT - Even if it's the same restaurant?
HAWKINS - Correct.
HOWITT - I'm talking the same name, the same business. So I were to buy X Y Z, and it has a liquor license. That license would not be transferred automatically with the sale of the business?
HAWKINS - Correct. The policy has been that less than a 50% or 49% change in risk if you're bringing on investors has been permitted historically, but anything more has not been permitted. So even if you're doing an asset buyout of the entity
HOWITT - That was my next question.
HAWKINS - 50% it wouldn't be permitted.
MILLER - Representative, I have one right now. And the policy at the board is you have to it does not go with the business. You would have to turn the existing owner would have to turn that license in, and the new owner would have to apply for a license.
HOWITT - Thank you.
MILLER - So it's not it's definitely not.
HOWITT - That that sort of clarifies a little bit of the confusion, I think. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER24 - Representative World.
WORRELL - Can you talk about the difference between the 2014 And this legislation, when it pertains to, the rollout of the license.
HAWKINS - That your representative I think this was a crucial point that was really9347 has been hit on in this legislation. What we saw, and I know Steve was also representing many, restaurant tours when 2014 legislation was put into place, you could qualify9359 for a license if you were in one of those neighborhoods or a main street district, but they weren't, kind of, put it in a bucket for each one of those neighborhoods. So that's why you saw, and as the, as the chairman mentioned, a lot of these places who were ready to go were in Dorchester. They weren't in some of these other neighborhoods, so all of those licenses are out. So even if I were to go and apply in Mattapan, even though Mattapan was one of the qualifying neighborhoods, they're not connected under that legislation to the neighborhood until they're actually physically issued.
So if it was issued to Mattapan, then it is tied to Mattapan. If it reverts to the city. But if it wasn't issued to Mattapan, it goes to any one of those qualifying neighborhoods and is then tied to neighborhood. So that was one of the distinctions that I think we all worked when we were kind of talking through lessons learned from the prior legislation was to make sure that, okay, just because someone hasn't ready to go in Roxbury or Mattapan doesn't mean they should all go to Dorchester. And that was also part of the motivation to look at ZIP codes instead of just neighborhoods as Dorchester is one Third of Boston Proper, not9428 every neighborhood in Dorchester, is in a has a public need for new restricted licenses, and that's why this was so narrowly tailored, and I don't know, Steve, if you have anything to add to that, but I think that's an important
MILLER - This is, straightened out that issue where now the licenses are specific to that naval well, to that district, the ZIP code. It cannot move to any other ZIP code ever. So it will be there, and as Leslie explained, if they in in 2014, there was a great need for licenses in Rochester. There was a lot of development. A lot of the licenses went9475 there, and they'll stay there. Now these licenses. If, if they're not granted, they'll sit there and they'll go on and be held for future development.
N CORIN - If I can just, speak to the time frame Rep Worrell is that, basically, with the 2000 and the chairs asked 2014 roll out, right, in the specifics. What we saw is that the folks who were ready, right, at the at 2014 are the people who are right at the door of opening anyway, right, or they already had a business and they want to add a liquor license. We've emptied the pipeline and we've drained our neighborhoods of restaurants for so long, and it's going to take time for some of these neighborhoods that have been historically divested up for so long, to get up and ready to open a place. And even if you have all your funding aligned and you have a lease in place, we hear from operators all the time that it can still take two years to open your restaurant. So the idea here is that there's a trench that comes out each year and that those are held by individual ZIP codes to allow each ZIP code to develop at its own rate and not to necessarily or unjustly award the ZIP codes or the operators who are already perched on the edge of opening.
HAWKINS - And I will just note, and I know, the chairman asked about the number of proved pending availability, and I know Steve probably hears it as well. We get the question all the time. Is there an available license? For me to apply for. Because it's not, I mean, these applications, you have to go through the community process. You have to pull together all your disclosures They're not cheap. Right? They're not cheap to hire someone to help you. And even if you try and do it on your own, it takes a lot of time. So if people are hearing out there. Hey, Boston has no licenses. There's nothing available, restricted, or otherwise. They're simply not applying, and they're sitting back and waiting.9571 So I I do think that that nine or 10 number pending availability isn't representative of all the people who are waiting to say, okay, we're going to we're going to pull the trigger when we know there's something coming down the pipeline. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - So you're going to lower your hourly rate, Steve? Is that what is that what I'm hearing? You're going to lower your hourly rate?
SPEAKER19 - Okay. I'm sorry.
SPEAKER1 - You're not going to lower your hourly rate?
SPEAKER26 - I think you're not going to lower your hourly rate.
SPEAKER1 - Oh, no. You're not yeah. You couldn't hear that
SPEAKER24 - at all.
SPEAKER1 - Could you? Completely deaf at this point. You can clean, you can clean deafness.
SPEAKER19 - Jammons.
CHAN - Thank you, Rep Worrell Robert's world. There is, Leslie also correctly pointed out there was also a 2006 Circumstance,9605 which is, if we ever go that far back on the committee, we will. But I don't we're not going to talk about that. At this moment, 14 is the more relevant conversation for this for the immediate future. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Representative Labuff.
LEBOEUF - And again, I'm asking these questions in the guardrail of, like, when I worked in my city manager's office, so I get it of this is not relevant or different from your process. Please correct me on this. What happens if there's a change of purpose with the business that receives the license?
HAWKINS - So these licenses, whether restricted or unrestricted, are so highly regulated, that everything has to be approved by the local board. And in almost all cases, the ABC So even if you're only changing your doing business as, that has to go before the licensing board for a hearing and approval. So any change does require approval. And the board, the licensing board is local licensing authority, has the legal ability to say yes or
LEBOEUF - Okay. So it would the applicant or the recipient wouldn't have to essentially surrender the license if they chain like, if it was a CAF if it was a restaurant, they decided they wanted to get an entertainment license and become a night club. Would that would they have to return that license, or would that be a separate process?
HAWKINS - The license wouldn't have to be9678 returned in last the ownership change was different, but the board would absolutely look to when determining if that change was acceptable. What there is if there is public need for that proposal. There's also9691 a completely separate board also headed by the chairwoman of the licensing board that reviews all9697 entertainment applications and requires a public hearing for any live entertainment. So that goes to say there is a significant process that goes into, a change of concept.
MILLER - There's also a requirement if you're going to change your concept or even, change your floor plan. There's an alteration of premises that9716 you have to go through the9718 community process and then you have to9720 go to the local licensing board for approval, and it has to be approved by the state commission also. So if you decided you were going to go from, at which there was there was a lot of discussions about changing from a rest run to a night club. So you would change your floor plan. You can't do that without approval, local board, and the, ABCc, and you wouldn't get to the local board without9743 doing a community process.
LEBOEUF - Okay. Interesting. So if I let me just give you a hypothetical scenario. I'm a restaurant. I have a liquor license. In order to get the liquor license, the ability to provide food, and then I decide I'm going to expand to have a back patio with either a radio or live entertainment? How many boards do you actually have to go through before all of those lectures?
HAWKINS - I don't know if you actually want the answer to that. You would have to go to the community in Boston. You would have to go through the community process. You would then have to go to the licensing board and then if you are adding entertainment, anything in Boston other than televisions and background music is considered live entertainment. So that could also trigger the zoning board of appeal. Before you even get to the entertainment board. If you are even so much as moving a bar, right, if this was by bar and I wanted to move it over there, that's an alteration of premise requires a hearing before a community process, a hearing before the local board, and a hearing, and the approval of the state commission.
LEBOEUF - What about licenses that are owned by a landlord? Would that be would that be if the landlord owned the building and had the license and the concept or the name of the this, that was the occupant change. Does the license, I guess,9816 can the license be issued to a property9818 like a landlord, or do would it9820 have to be issued to this specific entity that has the other types of licenses, the food, the entertainment, etcetera.
HAWKINS - So that is getting very, very much in the weeds, but if the entity that owns the license is not the one operating it, it would have to be a party to a management agreement, which again, is requires approval by the local board and the state board. So however you kind of structure this, there is still the9847 requirement that any whoever is9849 actually operating under the license has to be approved, and all of those terms have to be disclosed and moved to the local board in the ABCC.
LEBOEUF - Okay. Thank you. That makes sense. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER10 - Representative Skino.
MESCHINO - Thank you. I just, wanted to go back, for a second. So you do not represent the city of Boston?
HAWKINS - I do9872 not.
MESCHINO - And you do not9874 represent the city of Boston?
MILLER - I do not.9876
MESCHINO - So who are you here representing today?
MILLER - I'm representing myself, but I was asked to speak, my, my clients at, several of my clients as licensed holders, asked me to speak. And also, my clients, the Wine and Spirits wholesale is also asked me to speak in favor of the bill. So I am here personally as a license holder. Great. I'm here as an attorney. And I'm also representing several clients.
HAWKINS - And I am in the same position where I'm representing clients, both existing license holders and license holders?
MESCHINO - Because you both keep saying, we get this question all the9918 time. So are you representing off-site?
HAWKINS - No.
MESCHINO - And the so then what's the relationship between the three of you? How did you come to be a panel today?
HAWKINS - I believe just because it's a very small bar in this industry, of people who practice. I mean, I came up under Steve when I was an associate. I'm now at a separate firm term. I met Nick just because our names kept coming up just like Steve's name came up, and I think we were just asked because we had experience in the industry and could provide personal opinions and,
MESCHINO - Ask by who?
HAWKINS - Ask by who?
MESCHINO - Yeah. Someone asked.
HAWKINS - Nick, reached out to me. I've spoken to representative Worrell and Councilor Worrell as well.
MESCHINO - Okay. The reason I'm asking is because economic development happens in a very specific way, and it just9965 feels like this is putting the cart before the horse. And so I just wondering what the inspiration for putting in, bill like this first before we see planning and information and investments in, I mean, it was only just in the globe. I think that the mayor, she referenced it, an article, that she's put out a new programming but yet, this bill is before us and was filed timely. So I just that's why I wanted to ask. So thank you.
HAWKINS - And I will just say it. I'll let Steve to his experience, but I get calls every day from people asking me, especially in these neighborhoods, East Boston, certain areas of Dorchester, Roxbury, Mattapan, is there anything available? Is it even worth us trying because we can't even think about opening a restaurant unless we know we're going to be able to at least have a shot at a liquor and we can't go out on the open market and purchase 1. So I think at least speaking for myself, I see it day in and day out that there is a demand and there is a need even if it doesn't10025 get to the point of being on paper,10027 because they don't, you know, people can't invest in something that doesn't yet exist.
MILLER - Just to answer a question, Council Worrell, was referred to me very, very, very early in the process before anything was and down, and we, did what we could along with, attorneys like Leslie and other attorneys, Nick Cronin and whatever helped them craft a bill. So we didn't have the same pitfalls that we had experienced in the past, but like less, our firm specializes. We only specialize in a couple of things and liquor licenses, one of them, and we get calls all the time. The license is available. Clearly, it's very difficult. The price to enter to go into a smaller neighborhood with a smaller restaurant and pay $600,000 right now just it doesn't make it accessible. So, that's why I'm involved.
N CORIN - Got it. I10089 can speak just briefly. Like, the10091 reason I'm involved is because I the access to licenses and the access to information about licenses fall along the same fault lines of privilege and with in our city. And I am a restaurant person. I've10104 worked in restaurants my whole life. I'm a bartender. My community are people who work at and run the restaurants all over the city, and my peers in pretty much every other city in town across the country own their own businesses. And here, they don't we're getting pushed out, and I can count on one hand the amount of people.
I grew up with working a side by side behind a bar who own their own restaurant in the city, and I think it's due to10125 the structural imposition. So people are asking10127 me questions all the time because they want to be successful. But, fundamentally, we're pushing people outside of bus and if you go within a mile outside of Boston and kind of any direction into any of our neighboring cities, you'll notice there's a vibrant and growing restaurant industry, that fundamentally Boston is pushing out. And I want to be proud of the city I live in, but I'm watching this, like, march down the road of us getting bigger, well-funded chain restaurants and losing our independent operators.
MESCHINO - So what is exactly that your business does?
N CORIN - We do education and professional10158 development.
MESCHINO - For who?
N CORIN - For people who work in and run10161 restaurants?
MESCHINO - So you have10165 clients who are future restaurant tours.
N CORIN - Theoretically. Yeah.
MESCHINO - Are you representing any of them today?
N CORIN - No.
MESCHINO - Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Representative, we're we're out.
WORRELL - I just want to talk about the development. Not more solely a question, but a, a, a fact. In my district, we have about seven ongoing developments that's going on within my district. In the median, apartment size or, during this development is about, I want to say, like, 47 new units, that's 47 times eight with opportunity to have commercial space on the bottom floor, but talking to developers and talking to people who want to start their businesses, they're getting deterred. From having a 8000 square feet, feet, retail space because of the lack of opportunity of having a, a, alcohol license. So when you say that, you know, putting the, would you say the horse before10236 the cart before the horse. Developments going on nonstop in Boston. We're taking on the brunt of the development in Boston So with the brunt of development and housing in Boston, there should be at least something on10250 the, retail space to, you know,10255 appropriate for Boston. So that's all I just wanted to say. So there is a lot of development10261 and there is an act of people that want to get in this side of, having retail spaces on the first floor.
CHAN - Okay. Quick question. I we've heard a lot about regarding a distribution of licenses related to population, right, number of licenses for density of population. And the use ZIP codes as a purpose of this. But as you can hear from the committee, you know, we're focused in on economic development. And, the question really is very simple. I mean, why pick a number that you pick regarding an economic development point of view of what pending and ready to go versus using a ratio number of ZIP codes per population?
HAWKINS - I think I would have to refer to the drafters, for what the rationale was10311 there?
10313 CHAN10313 -10313 No.10313 I10313 figured I ask because you guys were providing immense amount of assistance, and I'm aware that Mr. Cronin here has information regarding ratios, which I once been quoting the ratio numbers, but it doesn't, address the issue of development versus just ratios of numbers of population. So with that, no, just want to put that question out there so we're aware of it. We may just put as a record request to the city they don't know that's coming yet. So we would just add it to the pile. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any other questions for the members of committee? They're being done. Thank you very much for your time.
SPEAKER9 - Thank you very much.
SPEAKER1 - We're going to take up, Frank Point vest, well, Frank Point Dexter and Nancy Cushman from the black Boston Black Hospitality Coalition in Wally's Cafe with the Masters restaurant United? Frank10355 is virtual. Frank can10357 answer that. You there?
SPEAKER18 - Can you hear me?
SPEAKER1 - Yes. Hello? I can't10361 see you.
SPEAKER18 - Alright. Hold on. Uh-uh.10365 Sorry about that.
SPEAKER1 - Alright. Patience with everyone. I had to understand we10377 live in a virtual world. This is we've been doing hearings all years like this. So, Edwin, patience as we get this together, Mr. Poindexter. So take your time.
FRANK POINDEXTER - BOSTON BLACK HOSPITALITY COALITION - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Alright. So I don't know if you need to hear me. You see me. I'm just going to be, be 68 and I'll let you know that I10393 support this endeavor, as, one of our family members and owners of Wallace We've had a liquor license for going on eight decades now. And, I'm also a member of the Boston Black Hospitality Coalition We understand and know that there's a, entertainment and sit down eating, Desert in Roxbury, Dorchester, parts and, and, well, I think that we need to, pass this measure in order for us to make our community is, more vibrant. We have a, non transferrable. I mean, we have a transferrable license at, while it's probably one of the older licenses in the city. But we understand that, you know, the more, venues that are, that are allowed open and the more opportunities that this, you know, that can be given, it will create a bigger community.
And, I think it's going to be a win win situation for, for the city of Boston. And then the other thing I wanted to mention was that you know, as a, leading market leading, city in the United States, due to our history and due to, just the amount of intellectual talent that's in this, in in our city. You know, we get a kind of a bad irritation for the fact that when other people come to visit, we get to let out a lot of tourists that come to Wales. But, you know, I'm always asked, where are other places can we go? And the this is not just from people of color. I mean, I'm talking about, a lot of our a clientele our, you know, people from all over the world, but they also want to be able to go to different neighborhoods and be able to,10500 get to know the city in in in in the deeper level. Okay?
And, and if we don't, provide any opportunities in those in these areas, and, you know, we'll want to maintain a bad rep, you know, we're going to have a good reputation. You understand? We're in, you know, a new age. And it just doesn't make sense that, you know, and it doesn't look good for us, nationally, internationally, that you know, we have deserts, in inside of, our city where, you know, sometimes it seems like, you know, tourists can't even go. So I would suggest that, you know, you know, we try to find some way to, to, something to alleviate these you know, concessions and recessions. And, and I, also want to say that the chairman did a great job of asking a whole a lot of questions I was there earlier. And, I got educated by some of the questions that you post, but, I think that with your, you know, you guys have the ability to, help us, address this issue. So that's all I like to say. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you. Nancy?
NANCY CUSHMAN- CONCEDED CITIZEN - Yes. Hi. Thank you to the committee and chairs for having me here today. Name is Nancy Cushman. I co owned six restaurants with my husband and chef business partner. We employ over 100 amazing people today. Four of our restaurants are in Boston. Our first restaurant O Ya is in the Leather District, 02111. ZIP code. It's now 16 and a half years old, and we have three restaurants in Fenway, 02215. ZIP code, Hojoko Gogo Ya and Ms. Clucks Deluxe. We also own and operate Bianca Woodfire Kitchen & Bar, Mr. Roni cups, Pizza Out in Chestnut Hill just outside of Boston. I'm on the boards of, Mass Restaurants United and MRA. I'm thrilled that both organizations are in support of Bill, but today, I wanted to share my own personal story as10614 an entrepreneur. I'm10616 going to go even farther back in the time machine10618 back to that 2006 moment. Past 2014.
I'm in support of this bill because the net of it is that, O Ya and subsequently, none of my other10627 restaurants would exist today had I not been granted that one non transferable license to open in the10632 leather district in 2007. In order to open O Ya we put10636 our house up as collateral for a loan. I remember the10639 pit in my stomach to this day of how it felt to sign those papers and think10643 that I will lose my house if this10645 fails. It was only after putting our house up as collateral and signing a lease that we learned that it costs up to $300,000 at that time for a license off the street This amount was a nonstarter for us, completely, excuse me, outsized to our total budget. And we wondered at the time, who else10662 but a major national Sean could actually afford this starting out. So our rent commenced while we waited to see if licenses would be granted. We started paying rent six months in advance of being able to get a license.
And then, thankfully, the license was granted, and we're able to open finally in March of 2007. In 2008, one year after opening, something happened that we never, never dreamed would happen. When we opened, the New York Times actually named our restaurant as the number one new restaurant in the United States outside of New York. Of course, it had to be qualified with outside of New York, which literally put it on the map both, and continue 16 years later to be a dining destination locally nationally and even internationally. And as recently as last year, Boston10706 Magazine, we reviewed us gave it a four star review and number one restaurant rating in the city. So10711 we're incredibly proud and humbled to be part of the dynamic restaurant scene of Boston, and I'm not saying any of this to be boastful.
But I'm saying it because I want you to know that none of that would have happened for us or for our staff without the opportunity provided by that first nontransferable license that we were granted. The success of O Ya has led to us opening five other additional restaurants and a number of our talented staff who's worked with us have also gone on to open their own restaurants in Boston and beyond. In restaurant 101 economics also wanted to share that most people who don't realize that 90 cents or more of every dollar that comes into a restaurant when you pay your check is actually going into the community. You're paying the paychecks to the folks that are working for you, paying the local food and beverage vendors. You're paying rents. You're paying real estate taxes, which is primarily pass right through to the restaurant owners and not paid by the landlords. You're paying insurance utilities.
And, most of what comes in besides credit card fees, which are a whole other issue for a different day, and insurances really do try to remain within or locally to the community. And it feeds an10775 entire wide ecosystem beyond just the four walls of that restaurant. So over the past 16 years, we've collected hundreds of thousands of dollars in meals tax on behalf of Boston, Massachusetts. We've recirculated literally millions of dollars back into that local ecosystem. Through paychecks, purchases, rents, real estate, now imagine that we weren't granted that license and erase all of those dollars from the locally economy. So as I've believed in 2007 and due today, a liquor license, which is something so essential to the success of a restaurant should be affordable. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - But this is Kushman. This Kushman. We we you for your reach time, and I gave you a few extra seconds. And I think we get the
SPEAKER2 - Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - We get the gist of what you're saying.
SPEAKER36 - Thank you so much.
SPEAKER1 - Any questions for the pacifier? They're being done. Thank you very much for your time. At this point, we would like to bring in, Jessica Meridian for the Masters Restaurant Association.
JESSICA MURADIAN - MASSACHUSETTS RESTAURANT ASSOCIATION - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon, chairman, Chan, Chairman Cronin, and other distinguished members of the joint committee on consumer protect and professional licensure. For those of you who I have not had the pleasure of meeting, my name is Jessica Muradian, and I serve as director of government affairs for the Massachusetts Restaurant Association. Massachusetts is one of the nation's most flourishing restaurant environments with over 16,000 restaurants and growing daily. The MRA provides access, influence, and protection to restaurant professionals, allowing for the ultimate opportunity to leave authority thriving business in the state of Massachusetts. One out of every 10 employees in the state are employed directly in or in a supporting industry of the restaurant industry, an undeniable driving force in the state's economy.
I am here to testify in support of more licenses in those neighborhoods of the city of Boston that are in need.10892 Many of the licenses that were once in these neighborhoods were10896 sold and drove growth in other neighborhoods. We must bring licenses to the places where there are neighborhoods that don't have them anymore. As we have said many times over the years, the MRA recognizes the need for additional licenses in the city of Boston, especially in those areas,10913 that are currently underrepresented. Restaurants play a vital role in economic development, and we don't need to head very far in either direction to see the impacts that well run establishment have had on the revitalization of a neighborhood within the city of Boston. one of the biggest hurdles facing aspiring dining and nightlife entrepreneurs is the limited supply of liquor licenses available in the city.
As I stated previously, Massachusetts is one of the nation's most flourishing restaurant environments. Restaurants are engines of economic development, they create jobs and act as vital community and family gathering spaces. Simply stated, more liquor licenses in these neighborhoods means more economic development and10958 more jobs. Licenses in these neighborhoods should be non transferrable. They should not be sold10964 or otherwise involved in the secondary and transferred to neighborhoods that are not in need. The city of Boston positions itself as a world class destination. It is important that we add more to liquor licenses to reflect our global and regional economy in all neighborhoods. I appreciate your consideration on the legislation before you, and I thank you for your time. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Well, you read that within the time limit. That's pretty good. Anybody have questions for Jessica. Seeing none, thank you very much. Thank you. I'd like to bring up, someone else that's physically here Pala, okay, I've been back to massacring names, folks. So my apologies, Palona Palletier Ozona, from the Deutsche Bay Deutsche Bay Economic Development Corporation.
PAOLA PELLETIER-OZUNA - DORCHESTER BAY ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon. My name is Paola Pelletier-Ozuna. And I am chief of staff at Dorchester Bay Economic Development Corporation, in Boston, and I'm here in support of the community we serve and offer testimony in support of H.3741 S.2380. An Act authorizing additional licenses for the sale of alcoholic beverages. Dorchester Bay is an economic development corporation and a community development financial institution. That's supports many minority owned businesses and restaurants in Boston in neighborhoods like Dorchester, Roxbury, Mattapan, High Park, JP, and Rosendale.
And we can attest to the importance of11063 expanding access to liquor licenses in the neighborhoods11065 that we serve. As we've heard today, Black and Brown businesses struggle the most. In City of Boston, liquor licenses follow a clear pattern of being concentrated in Boston's white neighborhoods. And the high price of liquor licenses in Boston, has always been a barrier of two entry for restaurants in low income neighborhoods of color. According to the Boston Globe, the neighborhoods with the highest number of white restaurants hold eight times as many liquor licenses per person as Boston's for most diverse neighborhoods, only 2% of on premise liquor license holders identify as black,11099 as we've heard today.
For many Bostonians of color, it has been a huge struggle to obtain liquor licenses, according to the Boston Black Hospitality Coalition, fewer than 10 of the cities on restricted licenses are owned by Black men and Women. Demand continues to serve as, supply. If renters want a license, they most likely have to negotiate. To buy it directly from businesses opening restaurants and bars where they can make a profit. This barrier is only one of many black and brown Bostonians looking to open a business encounter. I would11140 like to offer an example of Comfort Kitchen,11142 our neighbor and11144 small business client. Comfort Kitchen is black owned, immigrant owned, and woman owned. Comfort Kitchen's ability to serve alcohol is directly tied to its success.
They have professional craftspeople curating experiences for their diner crowd. And this craftsmanship led them to be featured in the New York Times Top 50 restaurants in the US the only Massachusetts based restaurant that made it on the list. Restaurants like Comfort Kitchen are an essential part of creating a vibrant thriving neighborhood. Their engines of economic development, they create jobs, and act as vital community gathering spaces. Restaurants in our neighborhood have been hit the hardest economically post pandemic,11184 and liquor licenses can be directly11186 tied to a sit down restaurant's ability to generate revenue and turn a profit. This bill would create restricted no certain non trust for all licenses as we've heard. And so today, I thank you for considering this testimony. I humbly asked report this bill out of committee favorably. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you. Thank you very much for your testimony. Any questions for Testifier? They're being done. Thank you very much for your time. Thank you. And we're going to take up, by Paul Rye from Comfort Kitchen since, you know, was mentioned. Okay. Not here at the moment. We're going to go back to we're going to go virtual now to Douglas Bacon from Red Pain Hospitality Group virtually. Mr. Bacon? Is Mr. Bacon up? Miss Ginger Brown, Ms. Brown from J. P. Center, South Main Streets. Virtual?
SPEAKER8 - Yes. I'm here. Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - Yeah. Thank good to hear from you. You got your three minutes.
GINGER BROWN - JP CENTRE/SOUTH MAIN STREETS - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Alright. So my name is Ginger Brown. I'm the executive director at JP Centre/South Main Streets. I'm also a resident and voter in the city of Boston 02121. Thank you for letting me speak today. I've actually been asked by my fellow Main streets to speak on all of their behalf. So, we are all asking that you pass this bill favorably. We are in high support of it. I had a prepared speech, but earlier11278 when I was listening to Mayor Wu talking, there was a question about whether or not the small businesses in our city, we're going to be ready to take the money, so to speak. And I can speak to specific examples about that in my district, and to make a plane, we had a restaurant called Canary Square. It was a fun place, well liked, a community hotspot. And one of the few places where there's kind of a nightlife there, they'd have, specialty drinks, movie nights, live music, that sort of thing. T
he pandemic came, and they couldn't survive. It was hard for them to stay higher and up, etcetera. Now running a business, And it's a large space for them was very expensive, and I'm sure that making the decision to close also meant that they were going to accrue some debt. So selling their full liquor license, which I'm sure at the time, was going for a good price up to 600,000, was an option for them to get11339 out of that. And walk away with a little change. That space has been11344 empty for a year and a half now. Rumor has it. It's going to be a life of life. I have no idea if this is true but I'm11352 scared that it will be because Life Alive is a corporate chain. Used to be owned by Panera, now owned by Jab Holdings, which is an Austrian company. And they also, Pete's Coffee, Einstein's Bagel, all the Pineris, etcetera. These are not people who are going to make good community neighbors. They're not going to buy into the local mini economy.
That all of the main streets work to support and encourage. We don't know if we can count on them to support the local back to school events. Or their main streets, or do things like even sweep up their sidewalk. We are hoping they will be. A lot of them can be, but what we do know is that we lost a part of our culture and character in Jamaica Plan. Those small businesses do have buy into their community They do care. I had another business that never even opened. It was open for less than a week, and they made your decision to close because they could not get a liquor license. It was forte, It's on Center Street less than a week because it's too expensive. one thing we can control is the price of licenses. If you start to introduce more restricted licenses, we can control that price. And it will help our small businesses, and it will keep that community and character that all of our residents love so much. I hope that you will consider11437 passing the bell favorably. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you very much for your testimony. Appreciate you keeping it under time. Any questions for the test fire? Dear, make none. Thank you very much. I'd like to11449 recognize representative Donahue, who's now joined us. Also, staff has pointed out to me11453 that, council president, Flynn, has11455 an letter testimony in favor from the city of Boston. At this point, we're going to go to someone that's physically here at Josh Weinstein from the quiet field. Also disclosed that it does have a restricted license in this in, East Boston, Mr. Weinstein.
JOSH WEINSTEIN - THE QUIET FEW - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you to the joint committee and the chairs for having me here today. My name is Josh Weinstein. I'm the owner of The Quiet Few, a small hundredish square foot tavern located in East Boston. This is very much a neighborhood place, a place for the community to congregate, celebrate, commiserate, and meet one another. Friendships have been formed, relationships have blossomed, and even some vows have been exchanged between people who met at our met at our little bar. I want to be clear that the quiet few would not have happened without a neighborhood restricted license, and the lack of restricted licenses in Boston restricts11513 only the opening of places like11515 while a11516 creative food and beverage scene continues to flourish in Somerville, Cambridge, and out to Worcester and Portland, Maine.
The opportunity for small owners to take their shot in Boston proper remains too risky. A chef wanting to open something new and inspiring needs a liquor license to succeed and cannot start an 600K in the hole because of it. It's not a sound business model. As the owners of the with deeper pockets, we'll not open a thousand square foot neighborhood place, because the need they need a bigger space to make their money on that license back, which in turn dilutes the creative pool. Before COVID, my wife and I had dinner at Celeste in Union Square Summerville.11554 The play the small place is overflowing with familial character. Both husband and wife were working in tandem in the open kitchen and the host stand, respectively, quietly dancing by themselves at the stations to the music of their native cuisine.
I felt like I was in someone's home. I was happy and inspired and also a little sad as is the perfect example of such a good thing that Current liquor legislation makes so difficult in Boston. My family lives in East Boston, near two Blocks from the quiet few, we're in contact with constant construction, huge condo buildings being built all around us. And every year, we enjoy meeting the new faces that move11590 into our neighborhood. Unfortunately, they have few places to spend their money. I know of multiple pending local restaurants held up in fully executed lease. Because they have no liquor license. So now all these new neighbors travel back across the harbor to spend their money to no way to build a community. The community needs more liquor licenses for the neighborhood to continue to grow. More bars and restaurants create more local employment. Our twentyish employees only four live outside East Boston.
More bars and restaurants keep the neighborhood money local and generate more tax revenue. But most importantly, more licenses made available to small businesses build the community emotionally. I'd be remiss not to mention the support our little space received the neighborhood during COVID. We hadn't been open a full year when COVID shut our doors, and without our neighborhood and the relationship we built with them, our doors would have11642 remained shut. Both financially and emotionally, our11645 neighborhood kept us afloat. The neighborhood needed us, and we needed the neighborhood. There's synergy there that's created11651 in the relationship between the small business and11653 its regulars, they hold each other up to congregate, celebrate, commiserate together. Thank you.
CHAN - Closing, you have a restricted license. Do you have any, business interest associated with legislation before us today?
WEINSTEIN - Yes, sir.
CHAN - Do you have any into would you do you have any, future interest in the legislation before us today? Would you benefit? I mean, would you apply for a license is the question?
WEINSTEIN - Yes. I would.
CHAN - Can you tell us where?
WEINSTEIN - Well, before COVID, we were looking to open a second location in East Boston. And right now, I'm, in works in opening in South Boston where we will be purchasing a license.
CHAN - In South Boston?
WEINSTEIN - Yes,
CHAN - Alright. Thank you very much.
WEINSTEIN - Thanks. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
We're going to take, someone Virtria now. Dev Devon Astaire. Are you still there virtually? A s? Alright.
DEVON AUSTRIE - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Here you go. Good afternoon, everybody. Thank you, Committee. Thank you, Chairman, for your time today and listening to everybody's accounts and just to have the space for us today. So I'll be brief. I currently work in the city as an accountant for a national nonprofit called international and locally in the city, as well as regionally just around New England, but just in Boston, I am a professional musician. Actually co create with a lot of the restaurants and a lot of the owners in the city as opposed to live entertainment and putting on programming around the city. And I would say that, speaking to the economics of expanding expansion on the resources that restaurants and other restaurant owners could be able to secure for themselves, night clubs, programming.
Wherever they could have, liquor that served in their in their establishments. It drives the economics. Folks spoke about that earlier, how it can be an economic driver, not just liquor, but it's certainly, a very common commodity amongst11776 Americans. So, as folks come into different parts of Boston to, to engage in its culture, engage in its neighborhoods,11785 definitely restaurants and anything that has live music is definitely a crowd drawer. Folks spend their money, not just money, but overall economics. That is our exchange, Philosophies are exchanged, and it's just more than just the money. But if we're talking about just overall economics that certainly does expand to different communities, I won't get into all the metrics since, the city has all those metrics.
They've specified them to you already, but I would say as somebody who creates with the restaurant owners and a lot of different owners. I haven't I won't be able to speak to every single, owner who's looking for a license, but I will say that there's a select handful of restaurants that do does tend to employ our services as artists. So, it looks like there is a, noticeable lack of, different restaurants to offer a liquor and offer a language statement and of the sorts. So in consideration of these two measures here, I would ask that you put that into consideration, more than just the economics of the physical money, but also what does for the culture and how it drives in other, individuals from all around the country, all around the world to engage in our culture in different parts of our culture, all around the city. So I would bring in that lens as a, someone who co creates with this industry and that's my time.
CHAN - Thank you for your testimony. So you work in the entertainment industry that services restaurants. Am I correct?
AUSTRIE - Correct. Yes.
CHAN - Okay. So you wouldn't apply for a license, and you're just interested in expanding the industry?
AUSTRIE - Yes. Just the industry itself, but not as a business owner at this time.
CHAN - Thank you very much for your time. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions for the testifier?
SPEAKER39 - No problem.
SPEAKER1 - You're being done. Thank you. We're going to go back in person to, Luther Pinkin from11896 the Pearl in person.
LUTHER PINCKNEY - THE PEARL - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon. My name is Luther Pinkney. I'm the director of11908 operation11908 for the Pearl Seafood Girl and Bar. And we are, a perfect example of someone who can be able11914 to benefit from this passing this bill and, who could have used it a few years ago. So we opened a11920 concert restaurant, the Pearl Seafood Grill in11922 the South Bay Mall in Rochester. One of the only one of the major reasons that we opened in that location is because it came with a non transferable liquor license. And the landlord was able to bake our rent tied directly to the license, and we're able to proceed that way. There'd have been no other way that we would have been able to come out of pocket and been where we are today without with paying 600 plus for a liquor license. We are now currently in a operation of opening our second location, which will be in Boston Landing, not one of these locations, but we are purchasing electrolysis, and today's price is $625,000, that was quoted today. So that is a, huge obstacle. The Pearl South Bay has occupancy of 50 people.
In that standing room, 33 people sitting. The next location, we couldn't do it, couldn't afford to nearly get a license if it wasn't going to be over a hundred people. That increases capacity to a great length. We wouldn't have been able to open that restaurant, a 700 seat restaurant, with the experience and the work that we had already two years ago. I'm a 25 year vet in in this industry. And I could not have done it without starting and scaling12003 up. It's a part it's the only way that a lot of people who are new12007 to this industry are going to have any chance So I'm obviously very, want to push this bill. I also believe, and I'm happy to hear the tone from everyone isn't that we shouldn't do this, but how do we do it appropriately? I stand behind the current administration. I think that they, thought it out they have come to us local business owners. They've come to ag activists. They've come to community members, and they are speaking for the community. They say that these licenses should be established for the community.12038 So I'm fully, hoping that we will pass12042 the bill, and I'm hoping for any questions that you may have.
CHAN - No. Thank you for your testimony. Just a little clarification. Maybe my hearing's off your restaurants in the South Bay, Dorchester complex, the big one off the expressway?
PINCKNEY - Yes, sir.
CHAN - Okay. So you got one of those, special economic development restricted licenses were able to leverage that license for value to help your restaurant develop. Am I reading that wrong?
PINCKNEY - Value. It was it was a test restaurant, you know, it's a concept restaurant. So we had to prove community to the city, to, investors that people wanted this type of food, this level of service, and from a provider that looks like me. As you know, there are very few of us12080 in this city of Boston that have liquor licenses and sit down restaurants.12084 So it was a proof of concept. We could not have even had this opportunity if we didn't if the establishment if the mall didn't have a liquor license for us. We are truly, when we my team and I came together, we wanted it open in Dudley, which is our newbie and Square, we couldn't do it. We had the space, but the license was the over ops the obstacle that we couldn't get passed.
There was no way we could invest that kind of money for operators who didn't have the experience. So again, if you want authenticity from people who live in the community, have to give them opportunity to shine. And that's what this administration in the past has able to do. Again, I've been in for over 25 years. So I go back a couple of mayors, and I know things have not always worked as they12129 said they should. I'm talking about this administration, the work that they put in already. I believe that they have they're going to do what they need to do to make sure these licenses not only get into the right hands, help the12141 community overall.
CHAN - Alright. Thank you12143 for the clarity. It wasn't quite clear when12145 you first went through that. And the second12147 question, and I think anyone's going to get the same question, is that do you have a, we're going to apply for a license if this it sounds like it doesn't. You already have a business that's not going to be in the south.
PINCKNEY - We want it for you if it's the second location. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Yep.
PINCKNEY - But, you know, I born and12159 raised in the same street in Roxbury in my12161 whole life, 51 years. So I do want to open businesses in my community12165 It is restrictive at this point that I cannot open a small tavern or bar or probably restaurant in Roxbury, Mattapan, or Dorchester where I live. I would be able to invest my time now in capacity to do that with a restricted license in that community.
CHAN - Alright. Thank you very much for clearing it up. Appreciate your time and your experience and your and12186 your testimony. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions for Testifier? You're being done. Really12190 appreciate your time. Thank you. We're going to take someone else's in person, Kiana Footes, from12202 the Daryl Corners' bar and kitchen.
KIN FOULTZ - DARRYL'S CORNER BAR AND KITCHEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Hello. My name is Kiana Fultz. I'm, thank you for having me, chairman Chan. I'm here to represent actually the, the service members, the bartenders, and also the management staff, actually worked for Darryl's Corner Bar and Kitchen, who was owned by Mia Graces actually one of, probably the only black woman, light, liquor license holders in the city of Boston. I actually do want to open up a restaurant for myself. But I feel that it's a disparity and I feel, it's very bleak for me. So apologies. I'm a little nervous. So As far as me being on the other side of things and I'm not, a council person or any type of government person, I have to travel a very long way in order get to the places where I work.
I would actually like to be able to do my, my love hospitality, and I would actually like to be able to operate in the neighborhood where I live, and I want to actually live in the Roxbury, Dorchester area. And it's, is just not feasible for me at the moment. So I just support the bill. I was asked to come and testify because I actually support this bill And as a person who doesn't have any, like, you know, vested interests or any political interests in it, I just, actually load up the industry. And I would just, like more opportunities for people like me, to be able to work and be able to actually dream and to be able to flourish in my community and create other opportunities for people like myself and the area that I would choose to live and the people that look like me. Are there any questions for me?
CHAN - We appreciate the sun sickness and the quickness of your testimony. So you work at you own a work at Darryl's Corner Bar and Kitchen. You own it?
FOULTZ - I work for the owner. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - You work for the owner?
FOULTZ - Yes. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - You're hoping to have a restaurant? You're hoping to have openings?
FOULTZ - Yes. I dream of having basically, a similar restaurant just like that 1, in the same, like, neighborhood that,12349 other people could come in, you know, have a proud restaurant they can sit in, but just not just12353 that one place, it various places in the ZIP code that is presented. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you. It's a I okay. That's great. You're looking to try to bring some development to your neighborhoods.
Any questions for the testifier? There being none. Thank you much for your time. Appreciate your patience. We're going to go virtually now, Joseph Johnson,12374 virtually. Joe we do not see Joseph Johnson in the morning. Abdu Cisse in person and god Abduce, Cisse? Or is that and was saying it wrong? You you can correct me. Get down here.
ABDUL CISSE - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you joined committee that's here for having me today. My name is Abdul Cisse. I've lived in Boston12418 for over 15 years, and I'm a proud dual Chester resident. As long as I lived here, I really don't go outside of my community. Because there's very few restaurants in12430 the entertainment spaces. So I find myself going on the other side of town, leaving the state for the weekend. I shouldn't have to leave my neighbor to get a sit down or good glass of wine or meal. Dining in its team and options shouldn't be one of one side of the city. Needs to invest in black and brown communities to create small businesses and restaurants. The additional12459 revenue of retail liquor sales would make a huge difference in our community, development, and tourism. We need to bring exposure to black and brown communities and show people that there's more neighborhoods in Boston to explore and enjoy. Thank you for your time. And vote 3741 favorable out of committee. Thank you.
CHAN - Thank you for your time and patience with us today. Again, quick question. If actually passed a bill, would you apply for a liquor license? Do you have an existing business you're looking at?
CISSE - Yes, I would.
CHAN - Which neighborhood you're looking at?
CISSE - Dorchester.
CHAN - Dorchester. Thank you very much. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions from members of the committee? They're being done. Thank you very much.
SPEAKER6 - Alrighty.
SPEAKER1 - We have David Doyle from Chris Agatos. It's in person.
DAVID DOYLE - TRES GATOS RESTAURANT - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you for allowing us, folks in the industry to share a few thoughts my name is David Doyle. I'm12527 co owner of three restaurants in Jamaica Plains 02130. Tres Gatos, Casa Verde and Tonino.12533 Tres Gatos and Casa Verde both have restricted neighborhood licenses. Tonino has a cordial license, which, may be sold. After having spent nearly 13 years in the restaurant industry, I can't emphasize enough how important a liquor license is to a neighborhood restaurant Tres Gatos open with a wine and beer license and within a year, we were already planning to upgrade to a cordial license due to demand from our guests. We were fortunate to be approved for that license.
12560 And12560 while it gave us more flexibility, we found12562 that our guests were still asking for cocktail that required a full liquor license. Fortunately, with a lot of community support, we were approved for a nontransferable all alcohol license and that has been critical to our growth over the past12575 decade. Incidentally, having that license was a major lifeline during the pandemic when our revenue from food sales plummeted. I'd really like to focus on the experience of my friends and colleagues at Comfort Kitchen which opened in Upham's Corner earlier this year in Dorchester. Like many other restaurant teams, their opening was significantly delayed and grew much more expensive due to the pandemic. When my restaurant Little Dipper was forced to close during the pandemic due to staffing issues, we invited Comfort Kitchen team to use our space for a seven month pop up.
We spoke at length about their many concerns and at12611 the top of the list, was whether they would be able to get a liquor license. They were convinced that without that license, they would not be able to succeed. Picture a highly talented and diverse team made up of people of color with a clear and inspiring vision for a restaurant that near the end of their very expensive build out still wasn't12629 sure whether they would get a license. This stress and uncertainty is not how we attract entrepreneurs in our industry. Fortunately, they did get a12638 license and just a week or so ago, as has already been mentioned, the Comfort Kitchen team was featured in the New York Times article12644 about the 50 most exciting restaurants in the country
I believe strongly that if this bill passes, we would be celebrating more success stories like this welcoming more neighborhood restaurants into unrepresented areas, especially first time operators,12659 and fostering more opportunity, cultural diversity, and economic growth in those ZIP codes, an area like the Seaport which lacks, the history and cultural diversity of many of Boston's neighborhoods, should not be draining licenses from other ZIP codes. The quicker we modify the existing system to ensure more equitable, stable, and transparent distribution of liquor licenses across city, the more likely12683 we are to enjoy a diverse, inclusive, and sustainable restaurant community that is a core component of a healthy and12689 world class city such as Boston. Thank you.
CHAN - Thank you for your testimony. I'm sorry to hear that you lost one of your restaurants during COVID. The committee had been, working very hard during COVID and monitored the situation in higher hospitality industry from soup to nuts for lack of better terms. So we're very familiar and feel your pain. Again, a very quick question, if this bill was to pass, would you be applying for a liquor license?
DOYLE - So possibly, I would like to stress that, my, as I, you know, near the middle to later part of my career in the restaurant world, my focus is much more on, helping teams like the Comfort Kitchen team, I'm actually meeting with one of my staff members from Tres Gatos tomorrow. This is a young woman, a woman of color, who very much wants to open a wine bar in Jamaica Plain. She's experiencing what all potential operators experience, which is that stress of, you know, trying to get a lot of balls in motion, such as finding a location, but not having any assurance that she will get that license.
And I feel I just want to stress that I12751 think the perception lack of licenses, regardless of the truth, that perception is very, very strong in our industry. And she is somebody who you know, has so much talent and12763 could do what the Comfort Kitchen team has done. But I feel like that that perception or reality of lack of licenses is really a barrier to, to our welcoming other restaurants in our neighborhoods. In the Comfort Kitchen team, I feel should not be an exception. You know, they should be an example and an inspiration, and we should see a lot more restaurants like that in Dorchester and across the city.
CHAN - No. Thank you for your respect. I really appreciate. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions from members committee? You're being done. Thank you very much for your time. Victor Fernandez in person. Is not here. All right. We have, okay, I'm going to man go name to I'm going to man go a name now. On, on virtual, Roke, Rokea, Raman? We got Yes. Oh, there you are. Did I mention your name, were you okay?
Yeah. I have to update this to you.
ROKEYA CHOWDHURY - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - My name is Rokeya Chowdhury, and I am our restaurant owner in Boston, and I am actually want to the recipients of that 2014 restricted licenses. And I am, in Roxbury, my cafe received it and we opened in 2015. And I am here to speak on, to the benefit of what my business has experienced from receiving one of those licenses. This has that particular license. We're a cafe breakfast and lunch, but you think, okay, what would, a cafe serve alcohol a breakfast or lunch. But one of the things that that has helped us do is host a lot of events.
A lot of private parties, and that's we would be able to not survive only doing breakfast and lunch throughout since for 2015 to now, but not only during that time, but particularly during COVID time, Later, we hosted a lot of events after people started to come back, and that has really helped us to recoup back and come back to where things were pre pandemic. So I am just here to speak on the benefit of these restrictive licenses, in in these particular neighborhoods. And I'm a one or holder of one of those licenses. In Roxbury. Thank you.
CHAN - Thank you for your testimony and your12924 perspective on the matter and your success your business. Again, quick question. If we pass this bill into law, would you apply for a liquor license?
CHOWDHURY - Yes. I would explore for new concept in Roxbury and Dorchester.
CHAN - Alright. Thank you very much. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions for the testifier? You're being done. Thank you very much for your time. Thank you. Next up. Mark Reed, virtually, reid. Mark Reed? Mark, are you there? Or we're not seeing you in person, Adelson Cardoso. Alright. Moving down. Omar Reid in person?12975 No. Omar Reid? No? No. Alright. We're moving vertically again. We're looking for Irene Chang Lee, right, moving back to in person, Mira Stella. In person, Meg Crawley, 3rdcliff Bakery.
MEG CROWLEY - THIRD CLIFF BAKERY - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon. Thank you to the chairs and for the to the committee for having us all here today. My name is Meg Crowley. I'm the owner of Third Cliff Bakery in Jamaica Plain. We have an insane amount of representation here today. I think that's because to make planes awesome. But also because we have a community that is extremely motivated with leaders who are super invested in small business and neighborhood development. So as I saw people, name check JP or our counselors or representatives, I just was overwhelmed by hearing that. And I think that it speaks to the efficacy of this kind of, work in programming. Just appreciate13062 all of our people.
I actually also live in Roxbury, so I'm, I'm overlapping with them. Senator Miranda, and representative, Montaño, who I did not know going in today had an addendum to 02130 to this, piece of legislation. So I came to just support peers in this piece of legislation as somebody who would not have been eligible, but I actually would really very much like to apply for one of these licenses. So my testimony might shift a little bit. I came to say that all boats13100 rise in a tide and that the more licenses there are, the more restaurants there are in more neighborhoods, the stronger we will all be as a small food community. I very deeply believe that I come from, The commonwealth kitchen is an incubator in Dorchester, for small food, and it is incredible.
I started out there as a mobile trike. Know some people know it. It's, it's kind of big in, in the Boston area. Really great way for folks who don't have a food ground or a lot of equity or a lot of access13132 to try something out with low stakes. I am also the recipient of a fair amount of13138 support from the city. I have a redevelopment loan, which is, partially funded by HUD, but man managed by the city. And I'm in the process13147 of getting a grant for a street front signage13149 through Restore Boston. So I would like to kind of reposition myself as a friend, supporting friends to actually somebody who is trying to jump in the queue and who has been supported by the programs that currently exist in the city for getting people ready for licensing.
I know that they have a lot more programming on the way, the space grants, etcetera, but I am the person who is trying to pull every lever and access every program currently available, and it's working. Our bakery open during the pandemic as a scaled down version, we'd o always hoped to be a bistro with, lunch and dinner and beer and wine. We started out just big breakfast pastries and Councilor Louijeune, I, who I adore, has come by a couple of times. She actually mentioned this earlier, and I really appreciate that support were, I I realize I'm out of time, but I think my point being that we weren't quite ready. We've been working really hard to get ready, this piece of legislation would help me grow to the next, next step.
CHAN - That that's okay. Thank you for your13216 time. I appreciate everyone's patience here today given the length of time. And, so your hope is to actually appear. This ex you're hoping this expands to include JPs. What I'm hearing?
CROWLEY - Yes. I would support it regardless. I live in 02119, in Eglinton Square in Roxbury. And so I13234 would consider future projects in Roxbury and on the other side of13238 JP and Rosendale, both of whom, are under the current legislation, but if it was added, licenses were added in 02130, I would hope to add it to my existing business and just extend our hours and menu.
CHAN - Alright. Thank you very much for that. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Anybody with questions thus far? They're being done. Thank you very much. Thank you. Man, okay, here we go. Manuel Rose Roseas, Bono, and East Boston in person?
MANUEL ROSAS - BONO13284 RESTAURANT13284 AND13284 CATERING13284 -13284 HB13284 374113284 -13284 SB13284 238013284 -13284 Hi.13284 I13284 just want to thank you guys for, having me here today, and sharing my own experience as a small business owner. I was going to I'm going to go a little bit of, script just because, after hearing all of these, I just want to share, like, I moved to United States in 2006. I always live in East Boston. I am a big fan, of Boston, Massachusetts and the dream of living here is, I want to try it as a business owner. Unfortunately, I opened13317 the restaurant, nine months before the pandemic, and it has hit me so hard. Yeah. To the point where, you13325 know, I had to take, I haven't gotten a paycheck yet and it's very difficult. But situations like mine, shows you guys that we want to do the best for our community. Don't want to leave in Massachusetts. I don't want to move to another state. I want to try it in my community. And then at times I thought my food was bad or my restaurant was horrible.
But, you know, like, I had developed for the past four years, very close13355 relationship with everybody. And they all say, like, I love your food. We love you. It's just that, you know, after a long day, we would love to have your tacos or your proposals with a with a beer and glass of wine. And it's understandable. You know, a lot of what we're what I'm doing to my clients is not making them go somewhere else to get13375 that excellent food that I serve. So that's one of the reasons why I support this bill. I feel like I worked so hard and I'm part of the community, I do want to get a paycheck and I do want13390 to try and I want to develop. And I also want to make sure that represent other small business owners. My place is considered as a takeout place, and for the longest time, I was okay with that. But after working in the industry since 2006, you know, as a bartender, most of my life, doing every single station in the restaurant business.
I feel like I want to be considered a sit down restaurant. And the only way I can actually provide a full dining experience to my customers is by providing them with everything they want. You know, dining is not just about putting food in your mouth. It's everything. You know, you want a nice glass of wine, you want a nice ambiance. And, you know, I also want to make sure that I'm not losing, employees anymore to the big names. Unfortunately, unemployment is another issue. Employees are going where they pay them more. I cannot afford to pay them more. You know, I can't even pay myself. So I just want to make sure that you guys, listen to my story and that's the reason why I went off script, just to tell you that we are We're here. I represent the small businesses. A lot of my friends live in his buster. And, and I really want to appreciate. I'm not demanding anything. I just want to, thank you for the time, and, thank you for listening to me.
CHAN - No. Thank you very much for taking to share your story and appreciate your patience for waiting. I,13490 I get it. My father worked in restaurants when I first got to the country. So I'm familiar with the13494 restaurant experience as well. So your hope is that we pass this bill. Are you able to qualify for one of these licenses down the road is what I'm hearing?
ROSAS - So I will be one first of the line. Yeah. That's for sure. And I've done everything. Yeah. I've done everything to get more people in but I feel like this is going to13512 really,13512 really help me out to stay in business in the future and thrive.13516
CHAN - Thank you for your testimony. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions from this committee? You're being done. Thank you very much for your time. Thank you. We're going to move back online, Elena Stinson. Stints0n. We do not see online at the moment, perhaps they're watching and jump back on later. Virginia, Sherbert, midnight morning in Rosalindale.
SPEAKER9 - It's Virginia Schubert.
SPEAKER1 - My apologies.
VIRGINIA SCHUBERT - MIDNIGHT MORNING - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Hi. Joint Committee and chairs. chairs. Thank13557 you so much for having me today. My name is Virginia Schubert. This is my first time owning a business in the restaurant industry. I'm the 100% owner of a brand new restaurant called Midnight Morning, located13569 in Roslindale Village, and the ZIP code is 02131. I also live in Roslindale, and my son goes to the Philbrick, Boston Public School. As a business owner and resident of Austin, I'm in full support of this bill. I, a 100% know that access to more licenses and neighborhoods in this bill are needed for entrepreneurs and small business owners to elevate our communities. There's so much potential here in Boston, and we need your help. I want to help as much as I can. I love Massachusetts, I love Boston and I want more businesses to collaborate with and personally support. Alcohol neighborhood restricted license, I would not be here today.
I would not have13613 28 employees, full time13615 positions, including myself. Business Midnight Morning, it's 1500 square feet, a rest is restaurant with a cafe and full bar. My goal is to be places for tasty treats, yummy drinks, relaxation, and good conversations. My restaurant an all alcohol neighborhood restricted, nontransferable licensed support, I've been open for two and a half months. one13651 year ago today, I was waiting. I was waiting to hear back from the state alcohol beverage control commission. If there was liquor license available, to me in Roslindale, and if I would pass all the requirements. I was waiting to know if I'd be able to open a dream of mine eight years in the making. Waiting is expensive. I13668 actually found my space 19 months ago. I negotiated contingencies in my lease purchase and sale, and the purchase and sale of the existing restaurant and business.
If I couldn't acquire a liquor license, I couldn't succeed. It was a huge risk for me financially, and I wouldn't be able to do it again, but I went for it used all the resources I could find, including technical assistance from the, economics department. I worked with the Local Enterprise Assistance Fund and Boston Local Development Corp. I'm lucky to have friends and family that supported me in my dream. My dream has meant to be a business owner to build a brand not only that serves a community of as guests, but also creates a meaningful positive work culture and environment for my employees. I want to create jobs and help people build skills to move forward and maybe inspire them to start a business or follow their dreams. Being able to13724 sell liquor is critical to13726 supporting all of these great ideas. I support this bill. Thank you for your time.13731 I also just paid my second state meals tax today. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - And I'm not sure we're
SPEAKER21 - going to exciting things.
SPEAKER1 - Well, I'm not sure we should graduates you or clap on
SPEAKER10 - on paying us taxes. Terrifying.
SPEAKER20 - Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - No.
CHAN - I appreciate taking time to share your story and the challenges of social putting together a restaurant. And I understand you hope that, you know, we pass the bill. We'll you'll be able to apply for one of these licenses is what I'm hearing.
SCHUBERT - I'm fig I'm figuring this one out right now, but absolutely, I'd love to grow for sure.
CHAN - Appreciate time and patience. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions for Testifier? There being none. Thank you very much. Thank you so much. I'm looking for Cheryl Strautcher. From Solay in Newbern Square testifying virtually?
SPEAKER43 - Hello. It's Cheryl Strader. Can you hear me?
SPEAKER1 - I can hear you.
SPEAKER43 - Alright.
CHERYL STRAUGHTER - SOLEIL RESTAURANT - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you for the opportunity to testify before the committee. I own Soleil Restaurant. We are located in Nubian Square. Probably identified as one of the underrepresented locations within the city as it relates to liquor licenses. I have a small restaurant. I've been here for five years. I too want to expand my opportunity to serve guests their alcoholic beverage of choice. I'm also probably one of the restaurants that our local politicians have not been able to hold an event because I do not have that full liquor license. So it's been said today why it's important and what it will do. For me, what it will do is restaurant doors open so that they can provide jobs, create revenue, have an identity in the community, give aspiration to other people who want to open a business. Nubian Square has long been a pass through. You can use our, location to get to JP, South Bend, and various parts of Dorchester and onto Mattapan.
It's not known as a destination point at this time, and that's what these restricted liquor licenses I think will help provide. It will be an13863 attraction for other businesses who want to come into the area. As a restaurateur, I don't see other restaurants as competition. I see them as, friendly entities that want to draw out residents to come out and actually support the businesses. It's difficult to survive in this industry. The cost of food is insane. You know, our expenses are just really,13891 really hard, high. Our profit margins are low. So having the ability to offer liquor would be something that would increase our revenue. Defying today in support of this bill and looking for the committee to13909 think about how it13911 would help communities like mine survive and even one day thrive. We are here trying to have a presence We have private events, and13921 we would love to be able to offer13923 a full liquor service to13925 our guests. Thank you for hearing my testimony, and I appreciate the opportunity. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Well, thank you for your testimony. Your patience on this long day, to testify, particularly screen. So I I hear you. I appreciate you sharing our story with you and your interest in a liquor license should the bill pass. So any questions from members of the committee? There being none. Thank13947 you so much for your time.
SPEAKER43 - Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - We're looking for Andrew Pierce in person.
ANDREW PIERCE - OZ WINE COMPANY - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Alright. First, many thanks to the joint committee and chairs for the work you all do, and thank you for having me here today. Name is Andrew Pierce. I live in Dorchester, 02124 near the Ashmont T Station and have been a Boston resident for almost 15 years. I've spent much of my time here working in bars and restaurants, but now I manage the spirits13992 division of Oz Wine Company. We're an independent importer wholesaler of wine, cider, spirits, and some other fun things that are not so easily categorized. Brave14003 new world and spirits and such. Anyway, I'm here today to lend my voice14009 in support of this bill. My life has been tethered to the hospitality industry for its entirety. While I was growing up in Western New York, much farther away from New York City than we are today, so please don't hold that against me. My mother worked as a bartender in a neighboring ski town.
Some of my earliest memories are of that bar. They serve lunch there and sometimes my mother would bring me with her when she had to work that service period. I learned to face and count bills about the same time I started learning how to read. Over the years, I helped with rolling Silverware into napkins, roll ups, restocking the fridges, beer pull, and on special occasions, like when someone called out sick, I would help with washing dishes in the kitchen. When I was 15, my mother got me my first restaurant job working in a kitchen, at a small family owned Italian place up the street from the borrower she worked. There I learned how to stretch pizza dough without tearing it, how to sweep and mop efficiently, and how to navigate the complexities of working with many big personality in a very small kitchen. Truth be told in the abstract that lesson is ongoing.
I worked in a few more14078 restaurants before moving to Boston for school. Shortly after my arrival, I landed a job as a busser at an Italian restaurant in the north end. The work was hard, fast paced, but it was an amazing opportunity and experience to, work alongside people from all over the world. After many months there, there was an opening for a barbecue position, which I was lucky enough to get. This began my other education and was the start of the career path I'm still on today. I've had the honor of managing the bar at some of our city's most celebrated restaurant months. There isn't time today to explore all of what I learned in doing that, but one thing I'd like to mention is profitability as it relates to food sales versus beverage sales. Profit margins are generally slim for most restaurants, but food costs, can be as high as three times that of alcohol. The license to serve alcohol can help balance the overall operating costs involved with running a restaurant.
Restaurants and bars serve so much more than just food and drink. They serve their community by being a place to gather. Visiting a restaurant in your neighborhood can be a great opportunity to and get to know your neighbors. They're a place to earn a living as I have, as my mother has. They're a place to learn transferable skills, like working with a team, a of communication, time management, and most importantly, patience. When you consider this bill, please give thought to the positive effect restaurants and bars can have the communities they serve, please consider the neighborhoods that would benefit from its approval, and please think about the last time you enjoyed a delicious meal and warm hospitality in the neighborhood you live in. We are social creatures, and I believe the more opportunity we have to socialize the better. Thank you again for your time. Be well.
CHAN - Thank you for your testimony, your patience today. You do you own a restaurant?
PIERCE - Nope.
CHAN - Okay. You're looking to open a restaurant.
PIERCE - Nope.
CHAN - Oh you just hear testifying14194 in favor of doing more restaurant business.
PIERCE - That's why I'm here
CHAN -. That's wonderful. Thank you for, sharing that. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions for the testifier? There being none. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you. We're going to switch back to virtual. We saw that, Elena Stinson has popped back on to Microsoft teams. Are you there, Elena?
SPEAKER22 - I am. Can you hear me? I don't think my video's working.
SPEAKER1 - Yeah. We can hear and see you.
SPEAKER22 - Oh, you can't see me. Okay. It just shows a red blurb here on my screen. So, apologies if
SPEAKER1 - Yeah. You got you in three minutes.
ELLANA STINSON - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Okay. So, my name is Elena. I am a Boston resident of 10 years. I've been a Roxbury resident for 6. I've seen neighborhoods like the Seaport and Fenway grow into bustling vibrant neighborhoods with options for eating, shopping, socializing. When I moved to Roxbury, it was a strong desire to be in in a neighborhood where I felt welcomed and not isolated. And having lived in Fenway, this decision to live in Roxbury very deliberate. Now being here for six years, I was hoping that my neighborhood would also be changing, and that eventually, I would have similar access to eatery shops and areas to socialize with my professional friends, many of whom live in Roxbury and Dorchester. What I have seen are closing, pharmacy shops, eatery wellness centers that I want frequently. And it feels like a deliberate neglect despite new payments and property and personal taxes at my downtown and Seaport counterparts.
I recognize the city and state's efforts to focus on diversity across industries and delivery efforts made with certain offices to expand night lives and grow wealth in traditionally underserved communities, and I believe it starts with keeping and aiding in the growth of businesses in Roxbury, Dorchester, Mattapan. In order to create these opportunities, we must take seriously, the equities in access to liquor licenses as they are central to and establish its ability to generate14302 revenue as we've heard over and over again today. And it's essential for them to keep their doors open. Otherwise, restaurants and other establishments are not able to sustain, and we will continue to see fast food and pick up14314 establishments in these neighborhoods will help you eating options or sparse. Additionally, the cost and time it takes for me to14320 pick up foreign transportation either train Uber or a car, but we have to pay for parking. And if that look strikes, and my meter runs out, I have to pay for parking tickets.
This creates additional costs to me almost as a punishment or additional tax for residing in a neighborhood, that I have chosen to live in.14337 In order to create an equitable city, we must treat all neighborhoods equally and respect all residents of this commonwealth. If the commonwealth is serious about ensuring access so all this bill is imperative. And by neglecting to have adequate and quality nightlife and restaurant opportunities in predominantly Black and Brown communities. The commonwealth is essentially forming a equivalent of busing where these communities have to leave their own neighborhoods and go to other neighborhoods that they do not reside. Having more equitable access to liquor licenses would give residents in Dorchester, Roxbury, Mattapan, and in Hyde Park access to same types of establishments that currently only available in those other neighborhoods. It is pastime for me and my neighbors to have equal access to community investment, healthier food options and entertainment. Thank you.
CHAN - Thank you for your testimony of your patience, well, with us today. Quick question. Did you own a restaurant? Are you just an advocate?
STINSON - I am just an advocate in looking to have more social entertainment14397 opportunities in my neighborhood, so14399 I don't have to go outside of my neighborhood. Or outside of Boston to seek those?
CHAN - Okay. That's great. Great to hear from you and advocating on behalf of your neighborhood. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions under testified from the committee. There being none. Thank you so much for your time and patience today.
SPEAKER2 - Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - We're looking for in person now. Ben Weber, are you here?
SPEAKER3 - In person,
SPEAKER1 - Devin Adams per line?
SPEAKER2 - I
SPEAKER3 - got two
SPEAKER1 - more.
DEVIN ADAMS - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you for the join14448 committee and chairs for taking time to hear voice and many of my colleagues' voices here today. My hope is to bring a unique personal perspective to the bill at hand. My name is Devin14457 Adams, and I'm a lifelong resident of Mass, former resident of Boston for about 17 years, and then currently a managing partner to two restaurants in Quincy Center. 202169. My story beginning in Boston from when I was 20 years old, working specific in hospitality the whole time from Faneuil Hall, North End Back Bay, Kenmore Square, Charlestown, all the way to Fort Point. My goal early on was to open up small business. It was a dream. And I went through multiple attempts in my neighborhood at the time. I lived in South Boston, and again, this is probably early 2000s
And after finding a landlord where I could build a restaurant, going through the community meetings, meeting at the state house, and sort of trying to find a way to get a full liquor license, which was sort of the backbone of what we knew we needed to do and what my What I had been doing, it just came to me that spending at that time, $350,000 to $400,000, was unattainable. Pushed me into another market where I ended up in Quincy Center. In 2015, we opened up a restaurant called, the Townsend. I was able to get a SBA loan it paid for, our opening staffing inventory, a complete build out of a restaurant, and a, full transferable liquor license. I was able to do all of that for less than the cost of a liquor license in Boston. Quincy itself, is built mostly of two to 3000 square foot commercial spaces, extremely similar to the Boston neighborhoods represented here today
It had made available over 20 of these, non transferable licenses, And I can say now with multiple, restaurants that have opened and used them, they are all independent. They are all about 80 seats or less. And you will see the owner operator at the door. You will know their name. three years ago, we opened our second restaurant who a Latin concept called Pearl & Lime It was done in part with a free non transferable license,14589 and instant hit that compliments in the neighborhood and added value and quality to everything around us. Soon after we14600 had spoken with an old friend of the hospitality business in East Boston about bringing a Pearl & Lime there. We looked at the space. We liked the surroundings. We thought that it would add value and also be complimentary. So we moved, after over a year of lease negotiations, tens of thousands of dollars in legal fees.
We could not capture a neighborhood liquor license. None were available We attempted to go in the open market, which at14629 that point had was $550,000 before transfer fees our liquor license. The build out cost for a 90 seat14638 restaurant, adding a $550,000 was not going to work. We ran the numbers every which way we could. It would be sustained losses for over three years, which in the restaurant business, you just can't run a performer that way. So we had to back out. I'd like to talk about what we can and do with our restaurants in Quincy because we did not have to pay $500,000 for a license. Our wages for our staff back to us in front of the house are over 50%, higher than minimum wages. We can offer dental. We can offer full insurance. We can offer them a more sustainable three or four day a week. Working plan, and they can afford to eat and live in the community around them. As can our regulars and clientele, we can just keep our, we can maintain value of the product that we're selling.
Restaurants which are unburdened by such a large cost are able risk that push culture, strengthen the neighborhoods, and make positive impact on the community and the overall economy. I also don't believe that the owners of the large corporations in that we see coming in here, spending over $600,000 are going to be the ones that you find at the door, donating gift cards and services to local charities, in rallying around the14726 neighborhood around impactful causes. On the business side of it, why does it have14732 to be liquor? Liquor is stable. What we saw through COVID was our cost of goods, both dry goods and food went up over a 100% they've come down, but they're still probably about 50% higher than what they were14746 before. Liquor is something that can stay on the shelf, that brings in, more diversified clientele for what you carry. And I think it's just important all around to be to think about what the business is beyond just bringing people in and making everybody happy. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Mr. Adams, thank you for your testimony. Could you just do we have a wrap up here or
SPEAKER4 - That's good.
SPEAKER1 - No. I pre Thank you.
SPEAKER4 - Thank you for your time.
CHAN - No. I appreciate your patience. I know it's been a long day. So I I do understand that. So my understanding is you have a place you're going to open up in East Boston. You're looking for a license as my understanding?
ADAMS - Yes. We attempted.
CHAN - Okay. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any, questions for test fire? They're being done. Thank thank you very much.
SPEAKER3 - Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - Got Jody Adams? This is called two Adams in a row. Okay. Jody Adams, trade, Ponto, and Cylint14799 Sala Ninski. No. Alright. Ronnie Trays Adams. three Adams in a row. Also listed as in person. No. Not you? Okay. We're we're all hoping.
SPEAKER5 - I'm I'm hoping I was next, but I gotta
SPEAKER1 - go. No. Well, you could be next. Who are you? Hardaway. Come on down. I guess so. We're at well, again, it's chairman's choice. Remember that, guys. I appreciate you, chairman.
HARIS HARDAWAY - BOWDOIN-GENEVA MAIN STREETS - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you so14834 much to the committee members. My name Haris Hardaway. I'm the executive director for Bowdoin-Geneva Main Streets. I know my colleague spoke for the entire, network, but she didn't know I was going to be able to make it today. So I thank her for her comments. There's important things that you all should know one, our representative, Worrell, we're very happy that he could, support such legislation to bring more liquor licenses. What I don't think is really being portrayed here is the fact that we're losing businesses and revenue. It's crossing over to Rhode Island. Crossing over to, New Hampshire. And we're trying to recruit businesses into districts like Bowdoin-Geneva, but we don't have the resources, namely liquor licenses.
And there's a lot of talk about gentrification. You stop gentrification by providing people with jobs and the opportunity to make money so they can support their communities. And without liquor licenses, full liquor licenses. It's almost impossible. Being ready means staying ready. And our communities have not been14910 able to do so due to the generational disparity that has happened without liquor licenses in neighborhoods such as Mattapan, Roxbury, Dorchester, and Rosendale, of which I have lived14922 in all of them. I am tired of folks leaving the community. Because they don't get the support from their commonwealth or their city because of what they look like or their economic background. It is very important that I implore you14941 You've seen Boston and Massachusetts recover.
But it has not happened uptown. It is happening in other cities across the state, but it is not happening in Mattapan, Roxbury, Dorchester, and Roslindale at the same rate. And we're losing out. So when you vote on this to move this to the full just later, hopefully, you will understand that you hold within your hands the grasp of people's lives, their families, whether or not they can still stay in the state that our fearless governor has said is a great place to live and is marketing this commonwealth to the rest of the country and the world. We need a fighting chance here.14989 And so I ask you to remember the people, remember districts like Bowdoin-Geneva, and the other areas across the city because we have already been prepared. It's just that there's no liquor licenses for us to do the jobs we want to do and make money. So thank you for your time, and have a good evening. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Well, thank you for your time and patience and your hard work on work and develop your area. Any questions for the testifier? They're being done. Thank you so much for waiting it out. Thank you kindly. We're looking for Chris Combs and handy husbands.
SPEAKER6 - Alright. Pleasure.
SPEAKER7 - Hi. I didn't write anything down. And I apologize I was not wearing a suit. I was at work, and I I thought I'd be going back. Maybe not.
SPEAKER1 - Dress only applies to what's up here, so don't worry.
ANDY HUSBANDS - THE SMOKE SHOP BBQ - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Oh, okay. So this is what I wear for my work. My name is Andy Husbands, I own The Smoke Shop BBQ. We have six locations. three of them are in Boston. Most recently, we opened, in Boston. In a previous life, I owned a small little bistro in15066 the south end. I remember 911. I remember the bombings. I remember Red Sox winning. I remember Red talks losing. And my point is it was a community living room. We didn't even have TVs, but people just came and they15083 came to commiserate, to15085 celebrate, and that's what restaurants do. I believe that everybody should have the right to have a restaurant in their neighborhood. Where they can do that. It's so special. I'm also here as an, o as the owner of The Smoke Shop in, Fort Point where we own a liquor license. And, we have no concern that these liquor licenses, will, affect us any way in our in the value of our liquor license.
And lastly, as I mentioned, I opened up in East Boston. And we spent millions. And, I would just like to kind of talk about the financial part of it, like being ready, which people are asking you about. So to get a liquor license, you need a lease. To get a lease, you've got to sign for that lease, and you've got to guarantee that lease. Some landlords, maybe a year. So a couple 100,000. Some landlords, the length of the lease, perhaps millions. And think of the scariness of, like, I've got to sign for this lease, but I don't15163 know how I'm going to do this. And then, so we opened East Boston with an auto liquor license, and I got interviewed by the globe and the woman asked me, well, you're Andy husband's. You can go raise $600,000. And I'm like, that may or may not be true. But what I did know is that she had never opened a business because you can't just spend money The way I look at is I had to pay that money back three to four years. I have investors.
I've got to pay them back. I have to respect them. Even Chris does a different way probably talk maybe talk about it for a he15199 does banks. I do investors, but you15201 got to pay that money back. And that's the only thing you have to do the15205 math. On that and paying them back. And you do share responsibility to your investors and your employees. We employ 250 people in East Boston, we have we've employed for the community. We offer ESL or in English as a Second Language to employees we advance from within. We're great employees. Our average cook makes 22.50. Our average waiter makes $33 and we're your first second job. English is not mandatory for us. So communities need liquor licenses think it's something you guys should vote for. And, I loved what the last guy said that you had people's fates in their hands, so that that was amazing. Thank you. And I and I know you're working late do. So I'll pass it on. Sure.
CHRIS COMBS - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you, Committee. It's an honor to be here today. It's actually the first time that I've done something like this. I actually wanted to start off to tell a quick story. I currently, manage four liquor licenses in the city of Boston I was a long time resident of 02122. That's right. I lived on Church Street right across15269 from Geneva and Bowden and started a little restaurant called D'Barr on Dorchester Avenue in 2005. And there's been a lot of scariness around gentrification in the room today. And I can just tell you that being in Dorchester for a really long time,15283 it's a much better place today than it was15285 in 2005, and it's going to continue to get better. But it's only going to continue to get better if we help people out a little bit.
I timed to market really well in Dorchester. From there, I opened my second restaurant in 2010. In the back bay of Boston. My third restaurant was in the south end in 2013, and then I opened in downtown crossing in 2018. And what I can tell you from experience is that this business is notoriously difficult with razor thin margins. And15314 I'm pretty good at this. And I have a lot of pricing15316 power, and it's really, really hard. The reason15320 it's hard and has gotten even more difficult recently is inflation has disproportionately affected our industry. However, it's disproportionately affected neighborhoods in Boston that we're talking about today. And what I can tell you is that if there were to be an establishment in any of these neighborhoods that we're discussing today.
They need to have the pricing power to be able to service the community. I'm not here today because I want one of these licenses. I, in fact, don't. What I'd like to do is I'd like to help others along to perhaps blaze their own trail as I was so gratefully able to do. There's a lot of people who came up here today, and they're just asking for the committee to give them a chance. So I'm here today say that I don't have a boat in the race. I have a restaurant in Dorchester, and it's 18th year. We employ 237 people in the city of Boston right now. We have above average wages, above average benefits, and that's only because I was given a chance. My father worked in a factory. My mother was a school teacher. I didn't have two nickels to rub together. Okay? But Dorchester rallied around the cuisine that I was cooking in 2005.
And we made a little bit of money, and15384 we got Obama funds during the recession to open the Bay. Sorry. Without that, Obama funds, I'm not sitting here today in a suit, talking to you guys, asking you to give somebody else a chance. It's really, really tough. No one who has the guts to open a Mattapan15398 is15398 going to get super, super rich, but they're15400 going to help that community out. The community needs it. We have the power collectively to make this happen. We can transform these neighborhoods that are so stuck I drove through Mattapan last week. Okay. I actually was playing pickleball down and, down at Bosse Sports. And when you drive through downtown, Mattapan. It's like, it's a time capsule. It's stuck. We can help these people. The liquor licenses will help. And I really appreciate you guys taking the time to me today. Thank you very much.
CHAN - Thank you for taking time to share your stories and, obviously, your patience for the day that's hopefully coming to end soon, based on the still more in the list here as you can tell. So, obviously, you're not interested in your license. You already have a license you're looking to expand? What's your plan?
HUSBANDS - No. So, well, I mean, first15450 of all, we'll look anywhere.,
CHAN - But that was a very straightforward answer.
HUSBANDS - I mean, we are growing business. If you got a space in Mattapan, we'll go look at it. We opened an HD without a license. I'd like point out that, it's amazing. I've never had a restaurant without a liquor license.15465 It was amazing how much money we lost about a $100,000 in six weeks. We15471 got a, a restricted, beer wine and, cordial license. If we had the opportunity, we would like to get a full liquor. one of our, pillars is we have a mass Massachusetts largest whiskey collection. So we'd like to keep that. But, you know, we're okay, but we'd15491 like to change if we could.
CHAN - I understand. You're looking to develop your business more. Makes sense.
HUSBANDS - Yeah. It's part of our brand. It's who we are.
CHAN - Yeah. I it makes sense. Any questions to test fires? There being none. Thank you for your time and patience today. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
We'd like to bring down Yovan Desmond and Edith Copeland, please.
YVONNE DESMOND - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Chair, Chan. Senator Cronin, ladies and gentlemen. Good afternoon. My name is Yvonne Desmond. I'm a lifelong resident of Roxbury, Massachusetts. I am a 7th descendant of this city. I have lived and worked and been educated and raised children in this city. During my childhood, my family lived on Kendall Street in Roxbury. They're trying to call it the self in now. I was born when they lived on that street. During that time and during the time that I grew, there were restaurants up and down Tremont Street. And the people in that neighborhood knew one another After15583 work, there were certain ones that they would go to, have a snack, have a drink, and be able to go to the next day.
My mother was a seamstress, and she worked in downtown on Neil Street all of my life until she got very sick from the fabric from the dust from the fabric. And times got hard. I did days work to help my family I went to school. I my career was as a social worker in the city of Boston. I worked for the Trial Court. I worked for Mass General Hospital. I worked for Dimmick Recovery Program. I have worked. I worked two jobs until five years ago. 54 years of working two jobs to take care of my family. I don't own a house, so I can't bring my friends and family by, and the all the those who come in town and take them to a nice restaurant in Roxbury, Dorchester, I don't own a car, so I'm not going to take the number 45 bus to Nubian Station and the green the silver line downtown.
And over to the waterfront, take that long train ride, the second silver line. I don't want to do that. But I would like to gather with my friends in my neighborhood. I earned it. I earned it. My blood, sweat, and tears are in this city. I deserve some fun, some time. Friends of mine, we call ourselves the elders of the Greater Boston Association of Black Social Workers, decided to get together on October 12th. We thought about where we could go to eat. two of us, one, I guess, maybe a few of us don't have a car, one of us just had eye surgery. Out of 20 people, 17 are going to be able to go. But where do we go? It means we got to go somewhere away. They chose a restaurant on the waterfront. That means that two buses, three buses, and a train for me. When are we going to start to be fair? I live in this community.
My parents lived in this community. My grandfather helped build, was a sandblasted for the Sumner Tunnel when am I going to get some of the things I want for myself before I leave here? I'm not 50, 60, or 70. I'm beyond that. My time is short on this earth, and I want to enjoy what's left of it. When we can't even go in our community up the street to sit down, to have tea, to have a short lunch, and it's a lunch that we're planning, There's something wrong here. I paid taxes. I did everything right. And we're here today in 2023, still asking for our community to get some of the things that the rest of the city has gotten. So I am here today to tell you it's more than just, having people have restaurants with liquor licenses, it's a socialization thing. And everybody else can go in their neighborhood and up the street or15776 drive up somewhere.
And they can socialize and have a great time. And I'm sitting there thinking, I can't be out too late. I don't have Uber. And I don't feel like paying the kind of money you pay to take a cab to go somewhere. I would like to be able to enjoy things in my neighborhood That neighborhood is zero 2121. It used to be just Roxbury 21. It is now Dorchester 02121. So I am telling you, I know the city. I'm not coming here to plead for anybody else. I'm just saying it's about time that I enjoyed my life here in this city. And I hope that you will consider that am a human being. My family is a human being. We deserve something out of this city. Not to mention that Irvin Washington was, relative of mine, he was a water boy in the 54th regiment. I'm a Bostonian, and I want to be treated like 1.
EDYTHE COPELAND - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you. Hi. My name is Edythe Copeland, and Edythe is spelled E-D-Y-T-H-E and I do live in Roxbury all my life, my 70 years, plus and I'm a retired school teacher. And I love Roxbury. I love Roxbury unconditionally. And the thing about Roxbury is that there's a lot of seniors that live in Roxbury, and they love to go out to eat I love to go out and just do things together as a group. Living in the area where I live, off a warm and streak, the only place you go to eat is McDonald's. And they not a fun place. So the bottom line is I want to pass this bill. No. I want you all to pass it, not me. And I do thank you for allowing me to speak to you. And also, I do thank God for allowing me to be here all this time to just talk to you guys. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Well, this15910 chairman's choice. You want to talk more. You're more welcome to.
SPEAKER9 - No. We didn't. No. You used up some of my15917 minutes. You know, this is how we do it. This is just
SPEAKER1 - No. I understand. Representative Warwood, would you like to weigh in? No?
SPEAKER8 - Oh, I live15927 Across the Street from you.
SPEAKER1 - Oh, dear. See, I just ratted you out. No. Thank, thank you so much for taking a time to come down.
SPEAKER10 - And If the bill doesn't pass right away, it's this fall.
SPEAKER1 - Chare Cronin. Chair Cronin has decided to lay down the law here and whose fault it is.
SPEAKER8 - Mine Jerrellas. We'd like to see it pass.
SPEAKER1 - Oh, no. Say? Right, my representative Any question?
LEBOEUF - I just want to let both of you know, I for three years, I used to work on 56 Warren Street, and I took that commute from Dudley Station to the Back Bay commuter Real Station to go back15962 to Worcester. So I am very empathetic to what you're talking about commute in, the15967 geography of the neighborhood. So
EDYTHE - And I'm a T ridder as well. So we meet each15973 other occasionally, and we just talk about all the things about Roxbury, all the things that used to be, It need to be right now like this cafe thing. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - No. Thank again, we thank you much for your patience and time. Thank you. Alright.
SPEAKER8 - Can I just say you were15991 such a gift to us today? Thank you. You were a gift to us today. Thank you.
SPEAKER9 - Thank you.
SPEAKER1 - Cleon Byrne Byron from 1102 Blues. I know the chairs aren't very, comfortable. We
SPEAKER12 - welcome.
CLEON BYRON - 1102 BLUE - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you chair, and thank you committee My name is Cleon Byron. I'm a Boston resident born and raised here. I am a business owner, 1102 Blue. And, my address is actually16043 1102 Blue Hill Labs. So we16045 just cut off the front and made it 110216047 Blue. Our space is actually, a community event space where we, do, like, bereavement, baby showers, anything inside the community that, the community wants and wants to do. This space is that we're trying to provide to the communities are very important. And just like, everyone else is saying, liquor help We want people, adults who want to do birthday parties and, maybe fundraisers for the city and stuff like that. And it makes a difference, for us to be16082 able pay our rent in our mortgage also. We this place, 1102 Blue, my family actually owns the building. And we've been trying to get a liquor license there for maybe the last nine years. And, Luther Pinckney from The Pearl, like he said.
We didn't have a owner who had a liquor license and we didn't have, you know, 600,000 to buy one. So it just left us there to be like, hey, what are you going to do? And we had to find other ways to make that space profitable. And nine years is a long time to be fighting to get access to something that I think that the community deserves I do travel around the city. I go to North End. I go to Seaport, and I see all these16133 vibrant places. And I look16135 at community and I say we can do it too. Just to give you a little background, my family has been giving jobs and employing people in Blue Hill Morton Street Area for the last 40 years. Alright. And just like you said, they create economics there. There's a lot of people inside that area that, you know, live off of us being able to provide jobs and some kind of economic stability there. And I think this bill, H.3741 and S.2380 are very16169 vital to our community. And16171 I look, to your representatives to do the right thing and help out the community, which is dying for help. And I appreciate my time. Thank you.
CHAN - I appreciate your time and patience with us today. So your location is in?
BYRON - Dorchester.
CHAN - Dorchester. Okay. So that's where we're looking to hope to, to acquire a license.
BYRON - Yes.
CHAN - Alright. Well, thank you very much. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions, committee, there being none. Thank you very much for your time. Hector Fernandez. Are you here? Alright. Doctor Shefir Armstrong. Doctor Armstrong.
SHELLEY ARMSTRONG - CONCERNED CITIZEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Hello. Hello. I want to first thank you so much chair Chan, Cronin, and the esteemed members of this body for having us here today. Thank you for staying so long and listening to me. I'm Dr. Shelley Armstrong, our business owner in the Codman Square District. Where I must note that we have zero sit down dining options where16240 we can get something to drink. I'm here to voice my support. of Bill H.3741, endorsed by state representative Liz Miranda and Chris Worrell. These licenses are not just permits. They are opportunities for empowering local entrepreneurs to improve and innovate and reflect the diversity of our neighborhoods and our communities. If you were to do this, we would be able to transform our now dead districts into more lively appealing hubs similar to16271 what we have going on in Seaport.
As a matter of fact, we have to travel from16275 our district Dorchester, Roxbury Mattapan, two places like Seaport. And of, of course, everybody's talking about the revenue that's lost, by our merchants. And I just want to bring that up. Representative Miranda and Worrell thought this bill out thoroughly. They envisioned our16292 neighborhoods enriched with unique establishments They want to offer various things, creating more jobs and strengthen the economy. So I urge you all, everyone that's here community members, stakeholders, business owners to rally behind this bill, and let's realize the potential of Roxbury Door and Mattapan, the same Roxbury, Dorchester and Mattapan that many of us that are here grew up in. And I want to thank you for your attention and say, let's work together to bring this to into fruition.
CHAN - Oh, thank you very much, Tessa Mody. Thank you for your patience today. Mhmm. So you're just advocating as a resident enabled to bring more
ARMSTRONG - Yes. I live in Roxbury. I own business in Dorchester, and I have to travel to Seaport, and I have to pay to go to Grace Fania. And I have to look for parking down at Daryl's, and I have to go down to the Pearl which is in South Bay. I don't mind it but we would just like more in our neighborhoods and so I am a business owner here for other business owners.
CHAN - No. That's great. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions for a testifier? They're being done. Thank you so much for your time. We're down to Royal Smith, owner of District seven tavern.
SPEAKER11 - Good afternoon, everybody.
SPEAKER1 - Don't worry. It'd be evening, quickly16373 enough.
ROYAL SMITH - DISTRICT 7 TAVERN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Thank you, joint committee and chairs16380 for having me here. My name is Royal Smith, a long time16384 resident of Boston, product of16386 02119. Also, a product of the BPS, and Johnson Mills University, top ranking New England university for the hospitality industry. I chose this industry specifically for a reason, started in 2002, and I wanted to do something that was protective that the computers couldn't take away. Right? So went to school, did all these things. Then I worked for Kimpton Hotels, Marriott Hotels, came back home work for great organizations like Back Bay Restaurant Group, American Food Management, in addition to Westmont Hospitality where I worked with a lot of local 26 employees throughout the city of Boston and the Commonwealth. After a while, I did the natural thing.
I went off on my own. I got an opportunity16437 to purchase such District 7 Taven, which is a small community bar in Roxbury.16442 If you guys are familiar with cheers, think16446 of me as the black Tony Danza. Alright. Alright. It's hard.16450 I have a stand alone place in the middle of nowhere. Edythe and, miss Desmond, they're in the neighborhood. We can't get a salad within a half a mile with the glass of wine of District 7, which is the 2nd financial hub of Roxbury. This is the reason why I'm here because this bill is my life. Like, this is all I do. And I just ask that you support it, and favorably16480 to the next stage. Know that This bill is a lot. It it's also the next Union City Orchard House. It's the next Bellingham. It's the next Wally's cafe, and that decision is on you guys. So, thanks for your time. And am I the last I think so. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - No. You're not. No, thank you for your time. Appreciate your sharing of us your experiences and, you know, you're hoping to expand your business in Roxbury as well. Hearing here. Yeah. Any questions for testifiers? Hearing none, thank you very much for your time. We're looking for Naya Grace. Nia. Nia Grace.
NIA GRACE - DARRYL'S CORNER BAR & KITCHEN - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Alright. Good evening. My name is Nia Grace. I am so good afternoon and good evening again to the chair as well as the joint committee. I am a restaurant owner here in the city of Boston. I own one restaurant Darryl's Corner Bar & Kitchen located in the south end, which was formerly Roxbury, as well as a new restaurant called Grace by Nia down on the Seaport. Those are both four value licenses that are transferable, but I'm definitely here in support of this bill that would allow new non transferable licenses into the market. I actually sit here or sat here several hours ago in a room full of my peers. Who I knew that did not have an opportunity to make it into this space without the addition of the, nontransferable licenses, back in 2014. I myself have a business that's been in operation since 1957 through two different ownerships.
And in that second wave of ownership, that person saw fit and the need to bring in alcohol sales, as another way of survival. And so since 1957, we've been able to employ thousands We've been able to be a community anchor. And again, what was formerly Roxbury, but now consider the south end. We talk about those changing ZIP codes and what would happen to a license should that ZIP code change at the end of the day. My license is still there. Again, it's nontransferable, but the impact that it has in the community on that corner is something that is long lasting. In fact, it has raised restaurant tours, even in my peer, Royal16631 Smith. We just left the sand here. We were both, in that industry together. So what I would like to16637 say specifically before my time is out. Sorry. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Don't rush.
GRACE - I think about trying to get into this industry and having been in it for 20 years and really desiring to be in the space for more than 10 years. My first thing is that I thought that the only barrier to entry was that was a cost. That, you know, a liquor license, even at 250,000 or 300,000 was going to just be the cost. And where it stands right now valued at 600,000 or more, in that secondary market. I didn't understand that there were actually no licenses actually available. And so for neighborhoods where you see there is, a need for it in Mattapan and Roxbury particularly. I have gotten calls from developers who said, hey. We see that you run success businesses, we see that you have a successful concept. We want to bring that to in liven our neighborhoods.
And I actually have to look at them and say, I'm sorry if the my question that I ask you is do you have a license available? And if you tell me, no, I can't even consider it. So I've been I've had that opportunity in16707 the last three years, and I've had to say no. And so for me and for others who want to see an entertainment, environment,16714 like even Devon, who plays for16716 me at both Grace and Daryl, have live entertainment, have music, and have a vibrant nightlife, and even daytime atmosphere, we want to see more of those licenses in our community. Again, I'll yield at this time. I just wanted to say, thank you, and I hope you support it and urge you to vote in favor of.
CHAN - No. Thank you for sharing. What business do you have? I'm sorry.
GRACE - My own Darryl's Corner Bar & Kitchen on Columbus Avenue, on the south end, as well as Grace by Nia on Seaport Blvd.
CHAN - Oh, wow. Okay. So would you benefit from this bill, or are you already having, like, you already have licenses?
GRACE - I have licenses, but like I said, I've had two different developers who are adamant about developing rich neighborhoods in Mattapan, and in my neighborhood of Roxbury on Washington Street between Dudley, now Nubian Square, and Egleston. And I was I had to look at them and say, I cannot do anything if you don't have a license, if you don't have licenses available. I also am aware that I've called down to the license and board in the city of Boston before. Say, Hey, I'm interested. I have this opportunity, and this was three years ago. Are there any licenses available? And it was actually laughable at that point. They laughed and not viciously, but laugh is saying that there were just simply none available to even consider. So if given the opportunity to do more to partner with other restaurant tours who want16791 to do more, I would absolutely be at the16793 table.
CHAN - Oh, thank you very much. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions from the committee representative will route?
WORRELL - Not a question, but I just want to thank you for your advocacy on this bill, being a black woman owning in the Seaport and also in the south end and reaching back for people who want to be in your spot. I thank you, and, much appreciated.
GRACE - I appreciate that. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - No other questions from the committee. Appreciate your time and patience today.
SPEAKER2 - Alright. Thank you. Take care.
SPEAKER1 - We're looking at Helen Barr held held in. Held in Barrado, That's okay. That's you. Clearly, I cannot announce you. You have no idea if I'm looking for you or not. Sorry about that.
SPEAKER7 - Leaving.
SPEAKER3 - I was just, they left. Hey. Good.
SPEAKER1 - It's alright. Take your time.
HÉLDER GEORGE BRANDÃO - ESTELLA RESTAURANT - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good evening. Everyone. Thank you for having me. I was actually going to tell the two young ladies in the back, the two senior citizens, that, it just makes sense for you all to, pass this bill. Rather you do it or not, I'm going to open up, a restaurant in Dorchester for people like that. Because they really deserve it, and the community deserves it. So, my name is Hélder George Brandão. I was born in Angola, I moved to Boston in 96. I resided in Dorchester for about 20 years. I own several businesses in the city, including the Estella Restaurant in downtown Crossing right down the street. I'd like to personally invite you all.
I was I was lucky enough to find and, purchased a transferable license for Estella during the COVID time. So I was able to get it actually for 350. But put a several million into it. But not everyone was so lucky to Either get that opportunity or forward on that opportunity as it's not an appetite, for most banks Most licenses never make it to the market or even kept within family, friends, limited new opportunities. I've been in entertaining the idea of opening restaurants in my hometown in Dorchester, but it's too difficult to find and purchase liquor license in Dorchester, it wasn't an option.16941
I really wanted to open up16943 indoor Chester initially. They even offered the16947 boss I cannot it16949 would not open up a restaurant in Dorchester without a liquor license. Yeah. That's just making no sense. There's a surplus of fast food spots in Dorchester community, already. So it would be nice to open up a sit down restaurant for providing good food, good drinks, and good vibes to people in that community who are begging and pleading, which the two young lady did, did. We need to bring more opportunity in in, ownership and undeserved community, the bill will provide us opportunities for others and, you know, like myself.
16989 CHAN16989 -16989 You16989 know, thank you for sharing your experience and your time. So where where's your business?16993 Could you give me a description of what it's like? No. Tell me your b tell me about your business.
BRANDÃO - Okay. So I own Estella down the street, 49 Temple Place. three level restaurants. Full legal license and entertainment. So that was open September 10th. We're actually having, an anniversary party on 5th, you all are invited.
CHAN - Oh, well, congratulations. So, yeah,
BRANDÃO - That's one of them. And then I own, SERVPRO franchises and construction, clean up and restoration and construction companies in Brighton JP Dedham and Roxbury
CHAN - Alright. So you're looking to expand your business or you're just here advocating to put more businesses into play? Want to speak?
BRANDÃO - I'm just looking to give. I really don't there's, I'm17047 really just looking to open17049 something in Dorchester or Roxbury. That's really where it's at. I don't have an appetite open at restaurants. It's a headache. So beyond quite, be quite honest with you, but I really if there was another, I've been in talks of opening up in Seaport with WSO, I have no appetite for that. I have He's willing to put him in. It's we spoke, but it's I have no appetite to open up in the Seaport, but I do have an appetite to open up in Dorchester. So I'm not17078 excited about opening up a restaurant. It's more the city that I grew up in. It'll give me some joy to put joy into other into that community that's it's needed. It's well, you know, the people deserve
CHAN - No. Thank you very much for sharing. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions for me, your representative will grow.
WORRELL - My last question. I promise. So, just want to thank you for testifying. You came from my district on Norton Street, which is in my district, and, the amount of support and love that you've showed people on Norton Street that they can do anything if they put their mind to it, and they, they always tell me about the George and Estella model going downtown. So I think if your advocacy and All the great work you're doing.
BRANDÃO - I appreciate that. Thank you all. And I must add that I had to go to another state to make, you know, to make it out. I had to go to DC. So leave that with a jump. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Romelda Pereira from Project Turnaround?
ROMILDA PEREIRA - PROJECT TURNAROUND - HB 3741 - SB 2380 - Good afternoon, Chairperson17174 Chan, and members of the committee. I17176 am Romilda Pereira, a longtime resident17178 of Boston, Massachusetts. As a concerned citizen of Boston, I felt compelled to address you today to advocate for the allocation of liquor license to the neighborhoods of Dorchester Roxbury, JP, and Mattapan. These three vibrant communities are home to a significant population of Cape Verdeans with over 65,000 residents from Cape Verde living in the city of Boston. Despite the rich cultural heritage of this community, We are currently facing a lack of establishments in these neighborhoods that offer an entertainment and recreational spaces.
I believe that grant and liquor license to Dorchester as the Roxbury, JP, and Mattapan would address this pressing need in a way that lasts longer than the single owner. While counselor Flaherty was worried about a few arguments and probate that pales in comparison to the amount of generational wealth that could be created for residents of color. By providing opportunities for entrepreneurship and economic growth we can empower individuals and families to thrive and achieve long term financial17243 stability, creating generational wealth is crucial for the advancement of underrepresented communities as it allows them by granting liquor licenses to these areas, we can open doors for residents to establish their own business, generate income.
And build asset that can be passed down to future generations, both in family and in our own in our chosen family community. In addition to economic benefits, the allocation of liquor license will also create job opportunities with these communities. This is particularly vital, as we strive for an exclusive economy that provides equal access to employment for all residents by encouraging that establishment of new businesses and entertainment sparks we can foster a driving local job market that serves both the immediate and long term interests of the community. I urge you to consider the allocation of the license to these neighborhoods as a means to support the growth and prosperity of these neighborhoods.
By doing so, we can celebrate the diverse cultural heritage of our city, promote economic empowerment and ensure a brighter future for17313 all residents. Thank you for your time and attention. I appreciate the opportunity to address this committee I look forward to witnessing the positive impact that the17322 allocation of liquor license will bring to the city of Boston. Also, rep Worrell, you thank George Helder, for what he has done for North End. I came from the same neighborhood. And what I can say is when he was able to make money to Estella, he gave that money back to our community. I am a founder executive director of a youth organization. And he has donated to us in so many ways that we were able to provide for the young people of that neighborhood. And I thank you for bringing that up.
CHAN - Thank you very much for taking the time of your patience today with us. It's great. Can you tell tell me a little project turnaround?
PEREIRA - So project turnaround is a nonprofit organization for incarcerated and formally incarcerated youth. So we provide resources to those that are coming home live a sustainable life and they don't go back. Chris Worrell has worked with us in many17376 ways and lives Miranda outrage17378 amongst17378 others. And we have a 85% success rate.
CHAN - That's wonderful to hear. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
Any questions from the test fire? They're being done from the committee. Thank you very much for your time and patience.
SPEAKER15 - Thank you, you too.
SPEAKER1 - Bing Broadrick. Jeran Skeins. Alright, Jeran. You have the rest of the you have the rest of the night to yourself if you want it.
17412 JUWAN17412 SKEENS17412 -17412 REDEFINING17412 OUR17412 COMMUNITY17412 NEIGHBORHOOD17412 ASSOCIATION17412 -17412 HB17412 374117412 -17412 SB17412 238017412 -17412 Alright.17412 Good evening. Good evening. Alright. Alright. Thank you all for being here and for having me. My name is Juwan Skeens. I I'm a 29 year lifelong resident of Dorchester. I am a BPS graduate from the Joseph Lee Schools, Timothy Middle School, South Boston, Excel High School. I am a community organizer for Redefining Our Community Neighborhood Association in Dorchester. I am the affiliate board member for the Codman Square Neighborhood Council. And lastly, I am a writing in candidate for large Boston City Council for this coming November 7th election. Glad to be here. 1st and foremost, you know, I'm really excited. You know, I just want to be here to uplift and support a passes of H.3741 and S.2380.
The reason for that being is because when we are able to provide additional liquor licenses for our businesses within the door chest Roxbury, Mattapan, High Park, Roslindale, and JP Neighborhoods, we are able to build generational wealth for these businesses. As well as provide sit down restaurant opportunities inside of our community. As a community organizer, I saw the effects that, COVID 19 had on our businesses, the displacement that happened, I was going around to17500 our supporting businesses as well around my neighborhood. And, you know, I saw the lack of access to education around applying for PP loans, for the expansion of their business as well as some language barriers. So I feel like this will definitely be this bill would definitely be one way that we can continue to meet the moment and meet our businesses halfway.
So that way they are able to focus on building generational wealth and wellness for their families. And also instead in in addition to giving them the liquor licenses, I want to make sure that we're also doing some educational, components as well, making sure that they're able to keep those licenses we I don't want to come to another hearing where, you know, we can see that, you know, some of our businesses, they don't know how to use the licenses properly. And then they end up losing them. So I want to make sure there's some education around that as well. And lastly, I want to talk a little bit about community benefits, right? The tax dollars that are raised through, these, these bills, for, you know, liquor licenses, the tax dollars that are raised. I would like to see some of those funds to be used towards Boston Public School Education, making sure that we're getting new textbooks for our kids.
Potentially paying for free lunches as far as kids as well. Maybe hiring some community bus monitors and crossing guards to make sure our kids are getting to17588 their destination safely. So it's just getting creative with, how we're able to, just expand those dollars for our community. And last but not least, where I think this, bill would definitely be a great pilot in the community. If you guys would look at the mall of Roxbury, and it just needs some rehabilitation and I would like to see an expansion there where it does have maybe a second or third floor of black and brown businesses where there is a sit down restaurant included, inside of that space. So, definitely, I would love to be advocate, with you for you, in regards to this bill. And definitely, if there's anything that I can do, please don't hesitate to reach out. Thank you. SHOW NON-ESSENTIAL DIALOGUE
SPEAKER1 - Thank you for your time and patience for waiting us out.17640 Any questions for Testifier? There being17644 none. Thank thank you for for taking the time to see us. Thank you. At this point, I've been informed by17650 staff that I've actually gone through the whole list, when the last call mode, so to speak, and seeing no more in the room, I am going to, entertain a motion to adjourn to hearing. Mo motion by, rep Moschino, second by, Representative Worrell. All those were fair to say, I, I, those against. The eyes have it. The hearing is over. Thank you for your patience.
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